Sea to Summit Bag Liner:)

[Kenneth Gurney]

“Introducing the Reactor® Thermolite Mummy Liner–the first to use Thermolite® from Dupont.”(REI)

I was taking a look at bag liners when I stumbled across an 8oz Thermolite bag liner that says it will reduce bag rating by 15*F… Thoughts?
And it can be used as its own warm weather bag… Thoughts?

This liner is extremely interesting and I will pick one up, but has any one used it?

Thanks
Ken

[Jose Beltran]

I have one. I have used it in the Sierras with temperatures between the mid 30’s to the 60’s. I cannot really measure that I felt a difference in temperature. Especially gaining 15 degrees. Using it by itself, maybe when the temperature is in the 80’s. It is so thin that you can see through it.

[EndoftheTrail]

Sorry to sound so negative, but I have tried the Thermolite liner.

I used it on a summer hike as a liner for an old 50F bag that I knew was optimistic, but figured the Thermolite’s 15F boost would make up the difference.

Nighttime temp. was about 50-52F, with a very slight breeze. I was uncomfortably cold the whole night — not deathly cold, but very uncomfortably cold.

When I returned the dxmn thing to REI and told my story, the manager just shook her head, like she KNEW the so-thin-you-could-see-through-it Thermolite wouldn’t boost temperature by much!

In my experience, a silk liner will boost temp by 2-3F, and the Thermolite by 3-5F (max).

This was my first (and last) experience with Sea-to-Summit products. I realize lots of people like them, and I am sure their other products are decent quality, but I am most disappointed with their utter lack of marketing integrity — which is also important to me. In terms of marketing integrity, I rank them the same as the lowly Slumberjack.

[Kenneth Gurney]

Hi Ben… Thanks!:)
I’m wondering if the material of a Bag(inside) has a factor on how a Liner functions?
This is just a thought…

And how do manufactures actually arrive at thier *F ratings for Liners?

Ken

[Douglas Frick]

>This liner is extremely interesting and I will pick one up, but has any one used it?

I have one. I’ve used it once, while hammock-camping here in Hawaii. During the night the temperature dropped to a chilly 65F ;) and I woke up shivering in my 55F-rated K-Mart fleece bag. I pulled out the liner, slipped into it inside of the fleece bag, and slept cozy for the rest of the night. I am not sure that it added a full 15F, but it did make the difference between shivering and warm.

As for using one as a bag, it is very porous material so it will provide protection from neither wind nor insects. The warmth for weight would be greater by adding more loft to your sleeping bag, but it does provide flexibility. I’m planning on carrying it for a while since I seem to be under-estimating the insulation for hammock camping (and because my internal thermostat is broken from living in Hawaii).

My tested weight of the Sea To Summit Thermolite Reactor is 10.2oz including the stuff sack.

[Michael Bachman]

Well…sorry to dig this up from the dead but I'll share some of my experiences with it. I was scanning all threads posted here in the the gear forum.

I went on an UL (for me)fastpack one night while it was lightly raining. I did about 12 miles that night only to find out I left my sleeping bag at home. Btw, I was sleeping next to a river in a valley, hmmm.

So I slept in my tights, patagonia capilene long johns, windpants, woolzip2, microfleece, micropuff vest and OR Ion (wind shirt). Basically all the layers I brought.

I managed to sleep ok on a cool low 40's degree night until right when the sun came up it seemed to drop a good 2-3F very quickly. It brought a cold front of air in and I woke up chilllly. So I immediately got up and started a fire to warm up by.

pros:

Stretchy, protects bag [when you have one], can be used on it's own especially w/a bag used as quilt. Customer service was also great with Ben.

cons:

15F doesn't seem realistic (obv.) and I question how they came up with this number. It's heavier than I'd like and packability suffers a bit imho. Also expensive and the only reason I tried one was because I got it for $35 shipped.

Edited for grammar. I also forgot to mention my shelter was a Tarptent Squall v.1.

[Mike Barney]

We've had a couple of Scouts that have these, and with initial high expectations of not having to buy a warm bag… Didn't work.

My experience is they do a very good job helping to keep the bag clean, in particular on longer treks, as they are much easier to clean than a bag.

We have 2 different liners, one pure silk 5 oz rated @ 9 degrees, the other a 10 oz blend rated at 5 degrees. At higher temperatures, I expect you might get close to these ratings (if you don't need a bag at 80F, would one of these work at 70 or 75? Maybe.

For the nights at lower temperatures I've used either of these, I don't think either of these provide more than half of their ratings. Yep, you can put one leg outside and feel a little difference, but if you really need the additional warmth, I'd spend the $50 – $75 on a warmer bag with a long zipper and a little more down.

My 2 cents worth,
MikeB

At lower temperatures, I don't believe either of these

[EndoftheTrail]

Maybe Sea to Summit makes some good stuff, but I was absolutely appalled at their blatant exaggeration about the so-thin-you-can-see-through liner being able to boost temp by 15F. Almost chilled my tail off that one night…

S-T-S lost my respect on that one, and for me to patronize them again, it will take a super spectacular product that no one else in the whole world can make.

[Andrew Browne]

I agree…. Sea To Summit specialise in spinning BS (in the Australian vernacular this means Bull Shit…in the USA it possibly means Buffalo Shit)
After Carol Crookers review of 06/28/2006 subject "Lightweight Dry Sacks: Comparison Testing Results" that showed that the Sea To Summit dry bags were not waterproof, I contacted them and spoke to someone in their heirarchy…managing director or something like that.
I was annoyed because 2 weeks before Carols article I purchased a number of these supposedly "waterproof" dry sacks.
Prolonged discussion revealed that Sea To Summits definition of waterproof does not include full water immersion for more than a few seconds!!!! They are confusing water resistant with waterproof…they claim they are using the industry standard……. Carol's article empatically proved their product to be "water resistant" but not "waterproof".
I'm Australian and like to support Australian Companies…very hard in the lightweight and below hiking area but Sea To Summit are pushing the boundaries to "spin" their products beyond their capabilities.
If there are some industry defintions/standards then Sea To Summit needs to comply

[Pieter Nienaber]

I bought a STS Thermolite Reactor bag liner last week to boost my MacPac Snowflake sleeping bag, which is really a liner bag ( down with no zip). I love my FireFly which is normally used with a silk liner. The guy in Paddy Pallin Perth was a bit more honest and said it may boost my bag by 4 degrees Centigrade (as opposed to 8 degrees Centigrade quoted by the manufacturer). I carry the Snowflake because of its light 500 gram weight. I am a warm sleeper. I hiked on the Bibbulmun track ( http://www.bibbulmuntrack.org.au ) from Balingup to Donnelly River. I was cold and I spent an uncomfortable night. I used the STS Reactor liner inside my silk liner, but to no avail. I will have to resort to my superb 1.7 kg down bag, which is far too heavy for UL. So, be warned. I love my other STS products, but this one, whilst being a nice liner, is not good value. Cheers, Chainsaw Pete.

[Gordon Dunn]

Consider the claims by two different manufacturers;

WM Linelite liner with 2" loft "adds about 10-15 degrees" F, 14 oz tw

S2S Reactor Thermolite Reactor liner "adds up to 15 degrees" F 9.0 oz tw

nuff said

Egads

[Worth Donaldson]

Over rated! I used it in conjunction with a 50 degree bag and when the temperature drop into the 40's I was uncomfortably cold in the early morning hours. Save your money.

[Pieter Nienaber]

The STS Reactor is just a thin layer of thermolite material. Quite a nice feel to it. In fairness, I was using it inside a liner sleeping bag (Macpac Snowflake). I use the Snowflake as my UL sleeping bag and have used it down to 4 degrees centigrade. However, I do stick to my original commntns in that the Reactor liner does not hugely increase a sleeping bag's thermal rating.

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