Cheapest UL Gear List Challenge

[Vick Hines]

Roger,
Yep, but if you aren’t wearing the right hat and if you want to adjust the beam up or down, yer SOL. I used to put velcro on my glasses frames – then I got rid of glasses.

[Vick Hines]

Michael Neal,
Have you put these ideas on a spreadsheed yet?

[Dale Wambaugh]

I could (and have) done this with garage sale and thrift store gear. As some have noted here, that is a process of opportunity and location, and I spend a fair amount of time on it– it is a hobby, no doubt about it. Thrift store and garage sale shopping success is directly proportional to time spent.

Next order of bargains: sporting good store sales. These are good for small LED lights, knives and multi-tools, shoes, and sports-oriented clothing like socks, shorts, wicking fabric items like briefs and tees, sunglasses. These stores are very good for running-based gear that transfers so readily to UL hiking. This is where I would go for a cheap sleeping bag and a blue foam pad. Big 5 and GI Joes are examples in my area (Seattle).

Clothing discounters like Burlington Coat Factory, Ross, Marshalls, and TJ Max can offer a lot of wicking sports garments, shoes, socks, briefs, hats, gloves, parkas, rain gear, wind gear and sunglasses. I often see Columbia and simlar brands.

The big box stores like Walmart and Target have a lot of clothing and gadgets. Target has seasonal sales on Gerber items. The Walmart grease pot is well known. I don’t have a Walmart close by, so I shop there infrequently, but I did note that they have water bladders cheap.

If you live close to an REI store, the garage sale area is a good place to check. This is where they sell returns and many are “just because” returns. I got a pair of Vasque Velocity shoes for $20 this way.

On the digital side:

Ebay is another area of opportunity and time spent, but the deals are there the range of items is enormous.

Craig’s List is the garage sale of the Internet.

There are outlet offerings from most of the major on-line gear retailers: REI, Altrec, Campmor, Backcountry, EMS, Dicks, LL Bean, and others have clearance or sale pages.

On-line tips and caveats: don’t be impulsive, know your gear, watch out for knock-offs (North Face is really picked on for this) and make comparisons. I have found a few items on Ebay that were new products to me and a quick search found them to be readily available and for the same or less cost. Shipping costs often negate the bargain, although it can be offset be the convience and driving is getting expensive. I was going to hit the “buy” button on a Maglie LED conversion kit and stopped to research and found that my local REI offered it at the same price, and I didn’t have to pay shipping, which came to about 40% of the cost of the actual product. I could afford to wait!

There is a lot of concentration on the cost of the “big three,” but the little items add up too. Things like bug juice, sunscreen, Aqua Mira, sunglasses, lighting, compass, whistle, pack towel, knife/multi-tool, first aid, and hygine items can really add up. Clothing is a major cost, and those “intermediate” items like trekking poles can put a strain on the wallet too.

Some of my favorite buys for new gear:

Lafuma sleeping bag: 800 Extreme, GI Joes, $50.
Micro LED lights: Ebay, Campmor, and Big 5, $4-$5 each.
Open Country 1.1 quart aluminum boiler: Campmor, $9.95.
Granite Gear Wisp pack: Ebay, new, $50.
Black Diamond Approach trekking poles: Ebay, new, $30

As far as used stuff, here are some real prices I have paid:

Mountain Hardwear Pack Pants, $12
Jansport external frame pack, $10
Mountain Hardwear polyfill bag (~30F), $10
REI Polayrgaurd HV bag (~20f), $10
Vasque Velocity shoes, $20
Nike Air Wallowa boots, $24
Marmot polyfill sweater $10
REI, Patagonia, Ex-Officio shorts: $2-$4 each
North Face convertible pants, $20
Patagonia, Nike, Under Armour, Hind wicking tops, $3-$4 each
Marmot DriClime windshirt, $12
Nalgene bottles, $2 each
Bolle, Suncloud, Maui Jim, Ray Ban sunglasses, $2 pair
Nike and New Balance wind/running pants $5 pair
Marmot and REI 1/2 zip base layer tops, $5 each
Marmot fleece sweater $10
GoLite Hut1 tarp, $70
Olympus Stylus camera, $3
RidgeRest pads $2-$3 each
REI rucksack (~15OOci) $3
Mittens with fleece liners $2
Fleece beanie $2

Yesterday I bought a pair of Patagonia “Baggy” shorts for $4, a pair of RedLedge rain pants for $2.50, a pair of Speedo Surf Walker water shoes for $1.99 and a Nike runner’s wind vest for $2.

The hunt is fun and can be profitable. I’ve run into all kinds of things I wouldn’t have tried if I hadn’t come across it at a yard sale or thrift store.

[Antonio Abad]

Sorry that I’ve posted a little late in the game. Anyway, I think the difficulty in comparing any two of these lists is the fuzzy “boundaries.” In other words, the items you assume you can just pick up around the household or mooch from your old hiking or athletic gear.

That sleeping bag is quite a deal from a performance/cost standpoint. Great find! My contribution for the shelter part:

Tarp: 9’X12′ 2mil plastic drop cloth. $3.99, 17 ounces.

Groundcloth: 9’X12′ 2mil plastic drop cloth. $3.99, 8-17 ounces depending on desired footprint

Guylines: Mason twine (bright yellow). $1.99-$3.99 depending on diameter. #18 is ridiculously light but probably not suitable for exposed areas. 1.5 oz for 50′? I think that sounds right.

Stakes: Aluminum gutter nails. 0.5 oz each, $0.50 each. I prefer bringing along 12, for a total of $6.00 and 6 oz.

“Tie outs” – Micro Grip Clips. $8 for a set of 4. Negligible weight…assume 1 oz.?

Technique: You can use a sheet bend at each corner of the tarp with mason twine and stake each lines out. You can run a line along the middle of the tarp to create an A Frame using sticks or hiking poles, with both ends staked out. Then you can attach two grip clips on each long side. Finally, you can run a single from line from stake to clip to stake to clip to stake. Kind of like a zig-zag.

Anyhow, the whole set-up costs you $24 or so, with a weight of around 35 oz. or so. If anything, it might be a good intro to tarp camping for the wary.

Caveat: It probably won’t fair well in high winds and exposed areas. I’m biased towards assuming sheltered spots in the woods given that I live in NEw England.

[David Wills]

Ide like to add the 5 oz $5 6×8 industrial PVC tarp/cape from GG (sheet bends for rope) and a 1 oz $5 AAA dorcy flashlight from WalMart. My sub 2 oz stove/pot/stand (tealight/coke can) is basically free. Could get it all to fit in a large mesh school pack from wally world $10 11 oz. Bleach for chemical water treatment (.5 oz) is basically free. An official orange shovel with ‘leave no trace’ written on it should be included, as this is for novices too. Bring an emergency bivy and 4 shots of golden grain (9 oz, $18) for 30* temps (I basically did on new years eve, about 35*, except no bivy and lots of clothes still in my pack)instead of a sleeping bag.

[Jim Colten]

I’ve managed to get 4 nights in ” data-lasso-id=”32950″>this $25 sleeping bag all with the unzipped bag drapped over me like a quilt, on a std thermarest pad in a TarpTent Cloudburst.

night 1
* forecast was for 30F but only got down to 37F, no wind
* was wearing light wool socks, light wt polyester long underwear tops and bottoms, rei brand nylon pants and long sleeve shirt, generic light wt acrylic scull cap
* was too warm

night 2
* 40F, no wind
* wore liner socks, rei brand nylon pants and long sleeve shirt, generic light wt acrylic skull cap
* was warm

night 3 and 4
* no thermometer, but lows approx 45, no wind
* wore rei brand nylon pants and short sleeve T-shirt and a very thin skull cap
* was quite warm
*

[Dale Wambaugh]

Big 5 Sporting goods carries a little LED light with output similar to the Microlight Photon that has a clip and a swivel. The put them on sale for $3-$4 a couple times a year. I’ll try to remember to get the brand name and model number.

[Tom Gibson]

The Lafuma Extreme 800 for $50 at GI Joes is a sweet deal. I got the last two at the GI Joes I was in, and they said that they don’t expect to get them again. The stuffed size is tiny, and for +40F it’s plenty warm. The ‘800’ is the *total* weight of the bag in grams–under 2 pounds for $50.

Once in a while you can get a used Luxury Lite pack directly from LL. $65 delivered. There are none available right now, but if you keep an eye on the LL website… Other than that, the mesh Wal-Mart bookbag mentioned elsewhere in this thread sounds like a great deal.

The blue foam $7.99 sleeping pad is very light (though it is bulky).

Any DIY alcohol stove is practically free and also very light.

Wal-Mart’s Swiss Gear tent & trekking pole for $35 has a *shipping weight* of 2.5 pounds, and that *includes* the trekking pole. I have no personal experience with this tent, but for $35 you could buy three, have two trekking poles + spare and throw a tent away every other year–it’d still be a good deal.

Re-use a plastic water/soda bottle for free.

Add a cheap aluminum mess kit for under $10 and you’ve got all the major items covered for well under $200.

[Vick Hines]

No need to buy the Walmart tent. They sell the poles separately for under $10.

[David Wills]

This is for 30* and considering the most minimal sewing skills- * = homemade
cost oz
*8.5×5 Cape/tarp$18 8
5 Alum Stakes $3 2.5
Mylar Gr. cl. $1 1
Thinlite Pad $8 2
Surplus 30* bag $25 36
*Stuffsac pack $6 4
*Coke can pot/tealight stove $1 1.2 oz (ziploc cooking)
2 1L coke bottles$2 3.75
*Med Kit $5 2 minimal
Dorcy AAA LED $5 1
Bleach for water$0 0.5
Survivo 5-1 $5 1.5
Toothbrush & Bronners $2 1
Plastic Spoon and Knife $0 0.5

That 30* bag solves the main problem. So light too. The stuff sac pack can be made by folding a large peice of silnylon in half and sewing the edges, cutting small corners off the bottom, sewing 2″ webbing on the back-top for shoulder contact and 3/4″ webbing to connecting to the bottom where corners are cut. Drawstring or roll top closure. Small packs need no compression. The 4 lb base will be easy on the pack.

Total is $81 and 65 oz, or 4 lbs 1 oz

[Dale Wambaugh]

“Wal-Mart’s Swiss Gear tent & trekking pole for $35”

That tent looks pretty good– it has some ventilation built in too. I would expect to give it a good going over with some seam sealer. I think the real test would be how it does in the wind, but that is the nemisis of all UL tents. Considering it has a floor and some bug screening, it sounds like a good deal. Like you said, the 2.5 pound weigh includes the pole and I’ll bet the stakes are heavy too. They mention a duffle bag for storage– I’ll bet that’s good for 6oz right there.

[Dale Wambaugh]

How about a BPL Esbit wing stove and a Stansport #270 aluminum canteen cup? Add a little tin foil for a windscreen and lid and you’re ready to boil up to 3 cups of water at a time for $6.98 and 6oz pack weight.

I looked around for canteen cups and all the US versions are stainless steel and thick at that. The Stansport is made in China and has the butterfly wire handles and is 4.7 oz. it could be lighter yet– the gauge is complete overkill.

[Elliot Lockwood]

I’ll add this to the mix. It’s by no means ultralight, but it is quite light; I thought it may be useful in the context of the thread. A complete rig from bag to framed pack to food (and almost everything else, including compass, rope & knife) for only $136.95.
Complete kit weighs 17.88lbs including the bonus of “$25 worth of free Mountain House freeze dried food.”

I’ve ordered from Major Surplus & Survival several times – they’ve got great prices, excellent selection & speedy shipment times. I have no experience with this particular kit, however.

EDIT: Sorry, I forgot to post the link!
http://www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=MSS&Product_Code=115940&Category_Code=23

[Tom Gibson]

Wow. It took a while to find that kit, but dang – that’s quite a deal. FYI, the item # is 115940.

It’s a <4lb external frame pack! The sleeping bag is heavy at 3.5lbs and there's plenty of 'extra' stuff you could trim from that kit to help get the weight down. If you bought one of the cheap <2lb sleeping bags referenced here you could probably get that kit under 15lbs and still spend less than $200.

You might want to cut the ‘two-person tube tent’ and call it a tarp while using the poncho as a groundsheet.

In any case, you’ve got to admit that kit’s a pretty impressive bargain.

[Elliot Lockwood]

Sorry that I forgot the link, Tom. (edited and posted in above message)

The sleeping bag is actually 4.5lbs (not 3.5) – it definately could be cheaply replaced. I assume that the tube tent is a plastic emergency shelter, and it would be best to use a tarp instead. In fact, the kit does come with a tarp, but it’s only 5×7.

I agree that it’s a great deal. I was almost tempted to get one to keep in the car and/or use as a loaner kit.

[Dale Wambaugh]

It is a good idea, but suffers in the details. As i was going through the list, I was thinking about tossing this or that, the relative weights, etc, and it comes down to a waste of time and resources.

IMHO, it would be better to teach the principles of UL hiking and let them seek out their gear, learning to make the comparisons and create their system. “Teaching them to fish” is what I am after.

If an supplier or manufacturer had the courage, they could offer beginner kits, but I could see the liability issues raising their ugly heads: some neophyte would go out and get hurt or killed using the kit and go after the supplier syaing, “XYZ Ultralight sold me this kit for hiking and I got wet and cold, and I got lost and…”

[Brian Kelly]

Bad News on the SwissGear tent. I checked the local wallyworld today and they had a few of these in stock (marked down to $30). I don’t know where they got the 2.5lb shipping weight from, because right on the outside of the package it said it was over 5lbs. I’m sure weight could be lost with lighter stakes and carry bag, but even after removing the trekking pole weights this tent is still going to be around 4lbs. Not bad for $30, but since its a single wall it can’t be split between two people so one person gets stuck with the full weight of the tent. I still may pick one up for giggles…

On a side note, has anyone ever put a good eye towards the footwear at Walmart? While none of it is great (and some not even “good”), some of the boots and trailrunners might be passable for a season. At the younger ages, a scout may grow out of shoes in one year. I can understand the need to protect their feet, but if they aren’t doing a lot of hiking it might be a cheap option if they don’t already own a pair of running shoes.

Now I am going to go and wash after all this talk of the merits of wallyworld merchandise…

[Tom Gibson]

So the Swiss Gear tent is indeed too good to be true. It’s 2.5 kilos, not pounds. Still, for price…

Wal-Mart footwear is probably great for the growing feet of the young hiker that doesn’t spend too many miles on the trail. I don’t know how many is too many, but I don’t think I’d want Wal-Mart hikers on my kids feet for more than 20-30 miles/season. If I had a 50-mile summer planned, I’d think twice about Wal-Mart (or KMart, or Target) as a source for footwear.

Wally World is a real conundrum for me. It seems that whenever I enter a Wal-Mart looking for something specific that I never find what I’m looking for. OTOH, if I’m not sure exactly what I want I almost always find something to buy.

I recently bought a family/car camping tent at Wal-Mart. It’s late in the season and that kind of stuff is on sale. I paid $64 for a Coleman like this: http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=3657599

I’m also conflicted about Wal-mart on a personal/social level. On one hand, they’re horrible for small town economies in that they kill the local mom & pop retailers but OTOH, they sure do save the average consumer a ton of cash. For some things, I’ll pay the premium at the local shop but for others…

[Dale Wambaugh]

I think someone got Kg confused with Lbs. myself.

An Ebay seller has been running auctions on the Wenzel branded version (Ridgeline) that comes with a fiberglass pole and steel pegs for $27 plus $11 shipping. He advertizes the weight as 4.5 pounds, so it may come in a shade under 4 pounds using a trekking pole or stick and some light stakes.

I would expect flakey seams and zippers, but I like the design. With some seam-sealing and some care you could get a season or two for a couple people. The emphasis is certainly on price and “reasonably” light. I wondered about cutting out 80% of the floor, but is hardly seems worth the effort for the weight and the loss of a nice ground cover.

For deals on shoes: Marshalls, Shoe Pavillion, and sometimes Ross. IN the Pacific NW, GI Joes and Big 5 run regular sales. Sierra Trading Post and REI Outlet can have some zingers if you know the brand and your size. I got my Vasque Velocity trail runners at the REI “garage sale” area for $20.

[Brian Kelly]

While running some errands at lunch, I perused through the recent issue of Backpacker. In their they have some sort of “Best Buy” challenge to see what you can get for your money at a variety of places, including Walmart. The intern tester actually rated the boots he bought fairly well (3 out of 5 stars). He did put them through 3 months of use and at $20 they held up pretty well (no real details offered).

I wonder if the price was taken out (and the fact that they are from WalMart) and put side by side with some boots from other manufacturers if they would have rated as high.

[Dane Fliedner]

OK, It’s a dumb question. But is Wal-mart what is frequently referred to as “Wallyworld” on these posts? I’m out west, and I figured Wallyworld was some store back east or in the southern states or something. (I realize this sounds stupid, but some areas have pretty silly names of stores… “King Soopers” supermarket in Colorado comes to mind…)

By the way, while we are on Blog Jargon, what does IMHO stand for? I see it here all the time, and IDGI (I Don’t Get It) :) Thanks!

[Tom Gibson]

Yes. I, for one, often refer to Wal-Mart as Wally World. I don’t fault you for the confusion, as I have also seen some strange retail names.

IMHO = In My Humble Opinion

I prefer IMO, as mine is not always so humble…

You’ll also see IME, which is Experience (better than Opinion every time).

[Rod Lawlor]

Carol Crooker had a great idea: screw a small alligator clip to a Microlight so it clips on a hat brim or visor. Trouble is, you can’t adjust it up or down, and if you aren’t wearing a hat or cap, you have to clip it to your eyebrow. Ouch!

Save the weight of the alligator clip and the cap. Pierce your eyebrow instead!!! (THose young people)

Rod

[Dale Wambaugh]

“Save the weight of the alligator clip and the cap. Pierce your eyebrow instead!!! (THose young people)”

Geez, I had my ear pierced in 1971. Young indeed.

UL hikers in the future will have a Velcro implant in the middle of their forehead :)

I want one in the small of my back to keep my pants up!

[Peter McDonough]

Ear piercing?? Hell I had my arm removed so that I have a negative total FSO weight.

[Author]

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