Backpacking Light’s New Thorofare Collection

[Michael Davis]

Yep, there's my email notice! I just ordered a pair of pants. Now I can truly have ants in my pants :-)

[Christopher Plesko]

Okay so say I'm a 5'11" hiker with a 30" waist and 34.5" inseam. What size pants should I order? I'm thinking small or medium?

Will these things hold up to light scrambling on rock?

[CW]

Wow. I'd say you're a small in the waist but XXL in the inseam. A medium is probably the best compromise but will likely be a little short.

[Christopher Plesko]

Yes I'm a tall(ish) skinny ultra dork. :) A little short is okay honestly. I hack most of my summer stuff to 3/4 length anyway, at least for the mountains.

[CW]

I'm a little odd sized myself. If you're not worried about length a small might work. I tried a small cocoon pro pant and it was a little snug so I stepped up to a medium. The thorofare pant is sized the same. I'm around a 32 waist but have larger than average legs.

[Peter McDonough]

Seem kinda expensive.

And I do believe that we have a matter of weight proportion here: just as a pound on the feet is equivalent to a few on the back, I think a pound in clothing is maybe an ounce on the back. Especially when I can get a supplex nylon shirt from Academy for $15 or for $12 from EMS clearance, this doesn't really seem like a good allocation of my resources to achieve lighter weight.

But that's just my take.

[Andrew Richardson]

Hmm..

Well, I don't think the price is too bad considering the price of other pants in the market. I mean you'd pay $40-$50 for a pair of pants if you get them when they are on sale at some normal sale, or maybe for even less if you get them at a great sale. So $65 doesn't seem TOO crazy to pay for a pair of pants that are light and perform well. I hike in pants and I think a light pair that is durable would be awesome so I may get these, I'll have to decide if they are worth the cost. I like to try my pants on. I tried on the REI sahara pants (those convertible ones, I think that is what they are called) and they fit SO baggy that I couldn't get them. I'd hate to order these pants and have them fit in a way that wasn't what I wanted.

Also, just a note for the folks at BPL, I looked pretty closely and couldn't find an example of which color was which. I assume the Sepia is darker, but maybe this could be made more clear.

I'm considering these. I hope I can get some after waiting to see what the initial reviews are as I'm too poor to be a tester of the first run.

[Brett Tucker]

Show me another lightweight, button-up shirt that's breathable AND mosquito-proof – at any price – and I, for one, would like to see the size of the rock it's been hiding under.

[Ryan Jordan]

Andrew,

Sepia is a medium-dark brown with a tinge of grey. It's my favorite color in any BPL gear we've made, and was inspired by the color of a RIT-dyed shirt that Don Ladigin wore on a Teton High Route trek we took together several years ago. I didn't forget your shirt, Don!

Desert Tan is, well, tan. It too has a tinge of grey, so it's more like sandstone than tan.

[Andrew Richardson]

Thanks Ryan! I figured the darker color was Sepia, but just wanted to make sure. It looks like a really beautiful color! I think you made a really good decision to remember that shirt and create one with a similar color!

[Ryan Jordan]

The reason we haven't yet introduced lightweight clothing for women is because of the economies of scale – and I'm not talking about production run minimums so much as achieving those economies during design and development.

I want to make sure we can deliver, and standardize, decent sizing on mens/unisex apparel, and then extend those garments en masse to women's designs. It's easier for us to extend a number of garments at once into women's sizing rather than try to do it one product line at a time.

Having said that, we have two more key apparel lines to release before we introduce women's sizing to market.

In addition, there simply hasn't been much demand for them through our forums (two here, good!) or our customer support channels. If that demand increases, then the spark that exists now may actually turn into a flame.

[Bill Fornshell]

Ryan,

I have read all about the shirt and pants several times hoping I missed something about a "fly" on the pants and sewn in briefs.

I am thinking about a set of these but I would have to modify the pants with the two items as mentioned above. I expect I could get by with a pair of silk boxers and give up the sewn in briefs but would sure add a fly on the pants

In designing these two items did you considered a fly and or sewn in briefs?

I can see all kinds of layering possibilities using this shirt and pants with a set of merino underwear for cooler weather.

I think a really good Sub 5 pound gear list for 4 seasons is just around the corner.

[Ryan Jordan]

Bill, these pants have neither a fly nor sewn in briefs.

While I did consider both during the design, the real goal was to create something that reflected that tenet of "simplicity".

In looking at other pants on the market, I found many of them that had a fly, a brief liner, belt loops, ankle snaps, a second cargo pocket, rear pocket, felted waist liner, knee patches, butt patches, instep patches, etc. etc.

So during design I started hacking those things out, deciding that these pants wouldn't need things. That is backwards to me, so I abandoned that approach and went back to the drawing board with a pair of pull-on pants, and added back only a few things (a few pockets, drawcord).

What I wanted:

Protection from sun, wind, and biting insects for minimal weight.

I had a hard time putting pockets on them even! :)

OK, back to seriousness. Regarding the brief liner, those of us who do wear a separate boxer/brief (stay tuned for a Merino UL version in 2009, mayyyyybe…) would have to cut out a mesh liner in the pant. I think many folks will be able to go commando in these well enough, too, with the absence of the fly.

The combination of the Merino UL and the Thorofare shirt/pants are terrific for cool weather. They are very comfortable for walking, hanging out, sleeping, with the warm inner lining and slicker outer surface that's not clammy like an outer shell of wind/rainwear.

Ryan

[Sam Haraldson]

A note on the sizing of Backpacking Light's new Thorofare Collection. There was some confusion over body-sizing vs. garment sizing. I've adjusted the sizing charts to reflect body-sizing for the new Thorofare Collection pieces.

People are generally familiar with body-sizing as it is the industry standard in sizing clothing. Simply measure your body and compare see where you fit within the figures located in the sizing chart located under the heading of the particular piece you are interested in.

Some of the other charts on the sizing chart page are based on garment sizing which is to say the measurements are based on the size of the actual piece of clothing. The sizing charts are noted as such if this is the case. Sorry for the confusion.

[Bill Fornshell]

Hi Ryan,

Thanks for the quick reply.

I agree that in this case "simplicity" equals lighter weight.

I just weighed the Patagonia silk boxers I had on – they weigh 4 ounces. I have some Patagonia Capilene briefs, they weigh 1.67 ounces. The capilene briefs might work if I found it necessary to wear something under the pants. These are both size medium.

The merino boxers/briefs sound like something to look forward to.

My birthday was this past Thursday. Looks like a new shirt and pair of pants will be a gift to myself.

[Sam Haraldson]

Happy Birthday, Bill.

[Bill Fornshell]

Thanks Sam,

I was 68. I think I have had a really good life so ever new day is like a bonus.

I have been better but I also have been a lot worse.

I ordered both a shirt and pants. I just might have a chance to try out my new pants and shirt before it gets to cold for them.

I lost my right kidney to cancer the first of July but it seems like my old body has recovered from that really well. I have a few follow up exams in Oct and if all is Ok I might be able to get up east for a few hundred miles on the AT.

These new pants and shirt give me something to factor into a couple of new gear lists. I also will be able to test them in some of our Texas heat and see first hand how they work for me in some real hot temperatures.

[Peter Atkinson]

Happy birthday and keep being a dude.

[mark henley]

68?

Heck … you're just getting broke in. You've got a lot more miles ahead of you.

Mark

[Bill Fornshell]

Hi,

I want to thank all who have wished me a happy birthday, here or with a PM. Both of my grand mothers were tough ladies and lived to be 92. I hope I can get close to that before my hiking days come to a complete end.

My birthday did give me a reason to buy both the new pants and shirt but I want to get the thread back on topic.

Sorry Ryan for causing the topic drift.

[Michael Martin]

Hi All-

One of the perks of being on BPL staff is the opportunity to purchase new BPL gear a bit in advance of its public introduction. I wasn't involved at all in the development of these garments, so please take my remarks below as those of an early-adopter customer, rather than a BPL insider with a marketing agenda.

That said, my Khaki Thorofare shirt and pants arrived today.

I gotta say, this is some of the nicest backpacking clothing I've ever seen. The fabric has a great bumpy texture on the inside to keep it off your skin, with just the right air permeability to balance moisture transport and wind resistance — very softshell-ish. Under a jeweler's loop, it appears to have a denier gradient which I imagine will further improve its moisture transport rate. I didn't see it mentioned in the product description, but it also appears to have a DWR finish.

The garments are very well made, with quality I'd expect from a first-tier apparel vendor, not a cottage manufacturer. It has just the features I really want — usable bellowed zippered pockets, plus hand pockets on the pants (I suffer with chronically cold hands…), lightweight snaps to control ventilation and bugs at the major openings…and nothing superfluous. And, it's *very* light.

For those who've asked about size, I'm 6'2", 160lb and ordered a size large in both shirt and pants. The sleeve and cuff length is about perfect for me, but the cut is a bit larger than I'd like. For somebody my height, but in the 170-180 pound range, I think it would be perfect. (In my case, a medium-long size would probably be ideal, but alas, no such option exists…)

I've used Cocoon products for several years, but this definitely takes BPL clothing to a whole new level.

Cheers,

-Mike

[R K]

"…The fabric has a great bumpy texture on the inside to keep it off your skin, with just the right air permeability to balance moisture transport and wind resistance — very softshell-ish. Under a jeweler's loop, it appears to have a denier gradient…"

Just speculating here but it sounds like a light version of Pertex stretch equilibrium or something similar to Cloudveil's own inertia fabric. Perhaps someone could post a photo?

Edit: Can never seem to these right the first time.

[David Ure]

Bill, I am taking this off topic again – god bless you and I hope that your recovery is (and will) go well. I have had cancer touch my family three times in the past 12 months and can emphathize what your family likely went through.

Get well.

Back on topic – any idea on the tear strength of these garments? I hate bushwacking but it happens sometimes…..

[Bill Fornshell]

Roy,

Interesting you would mention the Cloudveil inertia fabric. I have a pair of them, sitting next to me as I type this.

They are really great but they weigh 10 ounces. I hope the new Thorofare feel as nice on me as my Cloudveil pants do. The Cloudveil pants are almost to nice to use for hiking and they even have a zipper fly.

I expect my new Thorofare pants will have a fly of some-type within a short time after I get them. A zipper should be easy to instal and I will take the slight extra weight for the convenience. I can understand that adding a fly to the pants would have added some extra time to the construction of the pants and some extra cost. I will see what the extra weigh will be.

I will compare the material as soon as I get my new pants and shirt.

Added to thread:

Thanks Roy and David.

If someone doesn't post a picture I will try and take a few pictures and if they show the material well enough I will post them. I would guess I might see mine by the end of next week.

[R K]

Hi Bill,

Happy Birthday man!

The inertia fabric is great. I have a prospector hoody and REI pyrn (made of equilibrium) and both are similar to the description that Mike gave above. A picture would be great for clarification.

Hmm…or BPL could just come out and tell us but I'm sure they don't want to give away their secrets!

[Author]

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