Hanging A Bear Bag PCT style

[Kiel Senninger]

With the PCT method, the string that's close to and often times on the ground will actually raise the bag higher if pulled. Also, as long as the food bag remains on the other end, the clove hitch holding the "blocking stick" won't come undone.

I could see how it's harder to get the bag high enough with the PCT method, though, since you need to stand on your tip toes to set the stick which ultimately determines the height of the bag.

http://theultimatehang.com/2013/03/hanging-a-bear-bag-the-pct-method/

[John S.]

I'd imagine the engineers in this group could improve the pct method to make it compete with the counterbalance method.

Mod #1- food bag should have small loop on bag bottom. Cord free end goes through bottom loop instead of top of food bag. This lessens the distance it descends by 1-2 feet since the toggle stops at bottom of bag. Using the bottom loop may also lessen twisting of the food bag making it easier to bring back down.

Mod #2- For toggle use the rock bag (instead of stick) and stuff in remainder of dangling cord. The bag drawstring acts as retrieval loop, similar to recommended retrieval loop for counterbalance method (does not sound fun to attempt to find long stick or use trekking poles to retrieve).

[J-L]

I don't think the counter balance is superior to the PCT hang in any way. They are equal in how high off the ground you can get the food.

If a branch is 20 ft off the ground and I secure my clove hitch 5 ft off the ground, then the food will be 12.5 ft from the ground. If the branch is 25 ft off the ground and I secure the clove hitch at 5 ft again, then the food will be 15 ft off the ground.

Both styles depend on finding a good branch though, which is not always possible

[Dean F.]

But, since you asked for PCT hanging *tips*, it doesn't seem like this has been mentioned:

Sometimes it can be a pain trying to untie a clove hitch that has tightened overnight while standing on your tip toes. If you carry a blade of some sort, make a notch in the stick right under where the clove hitch will be. In the morning, snap the stick in half at the notch.

[Dave @ Oware]

I just spent 9 days doing bear hangs in sub-alpine fir forests within the grizzly recovery zone.

Next time it will be a bear canister.
I used the PCT a little and the counterbalance the most. My friends just used the tied off method, but split the hangs in two, hoping to keep at least 1/2 of the food. I very much preferred the counter balance method. We lost no food, but the bears are wild and we were a group of 7 plus a dog.

In the counter balance method I use a 1 mm retrieval cord, doubled so the cord slides through the hang, and the ends separated (ala Outward Bound) so if a bear grabs one in his teeth, he just pulls down cord. It is used also to raise the second part of the hang.

The Jeffery Pine forests and cliffs of Tahoe should be easier for doing hangs.

Why the counter balance method is better—-

1. Sierra Bears can grap a-hold of lines and pull the whole thing down, (limb and all if they have to) with a PCT hang. They are strong as, well, a bear. And the s-mores fed Tahoe bears have reached 700 lbs!.
*This is the reason the PCT hang is not allowed in many places. Jeffery/Ponderosa pines are self pruning of bottom limbs so you don't really know how strong they are, even tho they look good.

2. The limb height needed for a PCT is the same as a counter balance if you clip the second set of bags high at the same point you would tie the clove hitch. The simple tied off method requires less limb height.

3. You can hang twice as much food from the same limb with a counter balance method than either of the other two. Basic pulley forces apply.

—
*"A gigantic, bullet-scarred black bear with a hankering for human food and a knack for breaking and entering has been terrorizing homeowners on the north shore of Lake Tahoe and deftly outmaneuvering gun-toting rangers, bear dogs and traps.
The burly bruin – a male that weighs an estimated 700 pounds, roughly twice the poundage of the average adult black bear – has broken into and ransacked dozens of homes in Incline Village since last summer, causing tens of thousands of dollars in damage and more than a few sleepless nights.
Wildlife officials have tried everything, but the food junkie apparently knows a bear trap when he sees one, shakes off bullets like they were mosquito bites, and keeps coming back for more."

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Behemoth-bruin-terrorizes-Incline-Village-homes-3276299.php

[eric schultz]

David

"In the counter balance method I use a 1 mm retrieval cord, doubled so the cord slides through the hang, and the ends separated (ala Outward Bound) so if a bear grabs one in his teeth, he just pulls down cord. It is used also to raise the second part of the hang"

I am a novice at hanging, so please excuse my ignorance. I have watched the counter balance method on Youtube and it seems like there is one line and that line hangs on the ground to retrieve the food. The way that you describe the counter balance is that you use 2 lines. The 2nd line would double as a dummy line and a retrieval. If the bear pulls on the 2nd line, how do you retrieve your food? I think to use the counter balance instead of the PCT all I would need is an additional bag, Additional carabiner, and 2nd line. Your thoughts?
Thanks
Eric

[Dave @ Oware]

I have posted a really rough sketch of a hang on my blog. The retrieval cord is shown in red. You take both ends together to pull down. If the bear gets your retrieval cord, then you find a long stick and push up on one side of the hang. Or toss the retrieval cord over the sacks and pull down.

http://blog.owareusa.com/tag/food-hang/

The distances shown from the ground and from the tree are extreme. Most rangers

say at least 10 ft up and 4 feet from the tree. I developed the sketch when dealing with Sequoa/Kings Canyon bears.

I take 65 feet of cord and 65 feet of retrieval cord, two food stuff sacks, one small rock stuff sack. Carabiners are a luxury item,
but if you have many people using the hang and are continually raising and lowering it, putting on and off bags, then a carabiner is handy.

[Anonymous]

" pct method must have a string much closer to the ground, within any bears reach when they stand."

The relevant question is what exactly is the bear going to do once he reaches the cord?

[Anonymous]

"1. Sierra Bears can grap a-hold of lines and pull the whole thing down, (limb and all if they have to) with a PCT hang. They are strong as, well, a bear. And the s-mores fed Tahoe bears have reached 700 lbs!."

Can you point us to any reported instances of this occurring? I am struggling to envision how exactly a bear would go about grabbing a-hold of a thin spectra cord line and exert enough force to pull the whole shebang down.

[Cayenne Redmonk]

First the bear bites the line, then backs up 25 feet.
the bear proceeds to direct the cub to walk up the line like a tightrope. Physics takes over, the weight of the cub overwhelms the branch, your food is gone.

Bob Gross could explain it better. He always had a firm opinion on the pct method. He was not able to provide a single instance of pct hang failure, but was convinced they happen. I wish he was here to clear this up.

[jscott]

"The way that you describe the counter balance is that you use 2 lines. The 2nd line would double as a dummy line and a retrieval."

No, counter-balance uses one line with two bags, well, counter-balanced on either side of the tree limb, hanging from either end of the single line. there is no line to the ground or to another tree. this is the beauty of the counter balance. You retrieve your food by pushing up on one bag with a stick. this lowers the other bag; you untie that bag and the second one falls from its own weight.

[John S.]

Bob's thoughts on food hanging.
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/xdpy/forum_thread/31747

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