My crazy ultralight insulated jacket idea

[Allen C]

Ok so I know this is not completely original but I have this idea for a jacket that no one seems to be making…kind of a special purpose jacket for summer fastpacking trips in the Sierras, where I am either moving with a pack on (12-20 hours a day), or sleeping under a quilt. Therefore insulation is only needed on the front (and possibly on the sleeves but I'm thinking that may not be necessary). Or it could be a vest that is insulated on the front only.

Requirements:
Lightly insulated on the front only (either down or synthetic)
Ultralight windshell/breathable material everywhere else – Argon?
Total weight under 5 ounces
Hood optional – I have a zpacks down hood so I'm thinking no hood.

Basically an ultralight windshell with insulation on the front. I've never made a garment before, but I am tempted to do something like this. Is this crazy as a first project? Am I better off getting someone to make it for me? Should I buy an argon windshell and sew some insulation into the front?

I'm not working at the moment, so I have lots of time, but the only sewing machine I have is an ancient singer that only does straight stitching.

Any thoughts/advice would be much appreciated. Thanks!

[Bob Gross]

Another idea is to start with an ultralight windshell. Then use it with your own fabricated custom vest with insulation in the front and nothing but mesh in the back.

I made an ultralight photographer's vest one time. It is mostly mosquito netting, and it has five big insulated zipper pockets on the front. The insulated pockets were purchased as music CD pouches.

–B.G.–

[Allen C]

Bob – maybe an argon vest with apex insulation on the front? that would be pretty light, and I could use my helium 2 rainshell on top if needed.

Is mesh lighter than argon?

[Justin Baker]

Justin Whitson made something exactly like that but it was a vest. You should get in contact with him.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/profile.html?u=ArcturusBear1

Marmot also makes something similar but it has powerstretch in the arms and is heavy.

http://marmot.com/products/details/variant-jacket-new

[Bob Gross]

"Is mesh lighter than argon?"

It depends. There are some heavy meshes. There are some lightweight mosquito nets.

–B.G.–

[Allen C]

Justin, thanks – I PM'd Justin…I did a quick search before posting but didn't find anything, so thanks for letting me know!

Bob – do you have a specific recommedation for a light mesh fabric to use as the lining? thanks!

[BlackHatGuy]

Not quite what you're looking for, but along the same lines: http://www.patagonia.com/us/product/mens-all-weather-zip-neck-hoody?p=24201-0

[J-L]

I made a vest using the Thru-Hiker Minima Vest kit. Size small, Argon 67 inner, 3 oz Primaloft: total weight is under 4 oz. You could buy the kit, and just leave off the insulation on the back. It was my first big project and turned out pretty well. The pattern is nice to have.

You could use Argon 67 or Ripstop by the Roll's 0.66 oz/sq yd fabric for the shell and liner. If you want to use mesh for the back, try nylon tulle (about 0.25 oz/sq yd from JoAnns) or Ripstop by the Roll's new light mesh. I don't know if either would be durable enough for you – might be better to just use solid fabric

[Bob Gross]

" do you have a specific recommedation for a light mesh fabric to use as the lining? "

You didn't say anything about a lining. What do you need a lining for?

–B.G.–

[Allen C]

not sure, isn't a lining necessary to contain the insulation?
I see, you were referring to using mesh for the back of the jacket/vest.

[Allen C]

John, thanks for the reccomendation, that is a good idea..will check it out.

[R]

You really just need a sort of bib/apron. No need for a full front zip, or anything more than a string across the back of the neck and waist to hold it in place. A slice half way down the front from the collar should suffice for ventilation and then rely on your zippered wind shell to hold it shut when needed.

As Bob suggested, a continuous fiber synthetic insulation like Climashield Apex won't require a lining to contain it – it comes off a nice wide roll. But since you'll likely be sweating (fast packing) it wouldn't be a bad idea to put some lining against your body. 2/3oz is about as light as it gets for solid weave.

A heavier bit perhaps simpler route would be to find a cycling vest and add insulation. These are available with a mesh back and zippered wind shell front.

Curious to seeing what you eventually come up with.

[Bob Gross]

"As Bob suggested, a continuous fiber synthetic insulation like Climashield Apex won't require a lining to contain it"

I made absolutely no mention at all about continuous fiber synthetic insulation.

How do you guys dream up all of these things that I never said?

The ultralightweight photographer's vest used insulated pockets that were not fabric, fiber, nor down.

–B.G.–

[Allen C]

Bob thanks for your input into our dreaming. I'm not really looking for a photographers vest with cd pockets though, whatever gave you that idea?

[Bob Moulder]

A cycling wind vest might make a good 'platform' for a project.

http://tinyurl.com/q8xjrty

[todd]

"isn't a lining necessary to contain the insulation?"

Aaron Sorenson made some neat insulated clothing years ago for a trip (speed record perhaps?). He used the CS-XP w/fabric shell/mesh inner.

[Bob Gross]

"I'm not really looking for a photographers vest with cd pockets though, whatever gave you that idea?"

You were looking for something with insulation only in the front, and that is what I had made.

–B.G.–

[Allen C]

Todd, that sounds like a good idea too. thanks…maybe Aaron will chime in. I'm curious about what he made and how it worked out, how much it weighed etc.

[Allen C]

Bob M – good idea but I cant find the weight on that vest, and i bet it is too heavy by itself. I have something similar from MHW that weighs 3.4 ounces with no insulation. Lukes ultralight down vest is only 4.2 ounces so I am thinking that the finished product should be closer to 3 ounces if I eliminate the down and the 2nd layer of fabric on the back, and only insulate the front. It sounds like Argon is the way to go.

[todd]

I found Aaron's thread:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=5734

[Aaron Sorensen]

Ahh, that jacket.

I use it all the time.
NOT..

That jacket was only a mid layer so it wasn't very user friendly.

I would start with a Montbell Tachyon wind jacket.
If not a Montbell, then a different sub 2 ounce full zip wind jacket.

If you are between sizes, size up.
Figure out which and how much insulation in what areas is needed and sew and inner layer of Nobul1 to it with the insulation on to the Montbell jacket.

The hardest part about this is that climashield is a pain to deal with in 3d shapes.
Just sew the more difficult areas first.
I would go with an inner layer where the insulation will be. If not it will be scratchy and yucky sweaty much quicker.
It would be a pain to clean as well.
Nobul1 is also really soft.

If you used down in the front and insulation on top, you could save another 1/2 ounce or so.
Would be easier as well.
If using down, don't use Nobul1, Argon is much better.

Done right and sub 5 ounces would be a piece of cake.

Here is my 8.2 ounce M90 jacket with 2 layers of 2.5 in the front.
Lighter fabrics and much less insulation than this will easily be worth 3.2 ounces of saved weight.

.

Also check out the lytw8.com page for some possible ideas.

http://www.lytw8.com/My_Gear.html

[R]

Here's a rather different solution:

Mod your quilt so the bottom 18" or so zips off and use that as a body wrap. Add some light suspenders (Argon, z-line) and a few plastic watch buckles or velcro and you end up w/ something loosely resembling a vest.

All in this will add around an ounce.

Caveat: if you don't have enough insulation to keep you warm at night w/o the addition of the garment in question, don't do this.

[Allen C]

Aaron – thanks for adding your thoughts. I appreciate your advice and may go that route – the ultralight windshell plus apex insulation in the front and shoulders.

Rene – that is also a good idea…I'm leaning away from that though as it seems prudent to not risk getting the quilt (or part of it) wet if I need the insulation while moving through a cold wet storm scenario. And it is nice to have a bit of extra insulation to add to the 30 degree quilt if necessary.

[William Kerber]

Just DIY the Thru-Hiker Minima vest kit with 2.5 Climashield and don't add the insulation on the back. Probably come in at 3 ozs or less.

Or, this..

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=87100

[Allen C]

OK so I'm leaning towards making a vest with 2.5 Apex on the front only and ordering the materials myself rather than the kit. Should I get the .67 Argon fabric for the body and lining? Is there something more breathable but comparably light/durable that I could use on the back/lining, (not just mesh) or just keep it simple and use argon for the whole thing? or is M50 better? I think breathability is more important than windproofness or DWR for this application.

I'm thinking 2 yards of argon and 1 yard of Apex should do it, plus a zipper and some thread. I've never made a garment before so if I'm missing something important let me know. Is there a free pattern for a vest online somewhere that would work for this?

My wife can help with the sewing or at least get me started. Thanks to all for the advice…I'm excited about starting my first MYOG project!

[Author]

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