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ULA Catalyst vs HMG Windrider 4400…
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Home › Forums › Gear Forums › Gear (General) › ULA Catalyst vs HMG Windrider 4400…
- This topic has 20 replies, 11 voices, and was last updated 7 years, 7 months ago by Don Burton.
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Aug 27, 2016 at 1:47 pm #3422964
For a September JMT thru-hike with Bearikade Expedition. Which one wins and and why? Thanks!
Aug 27, 2016 at 2:34 pm #3422972Tough question, very subjective.
I owned a Catalyst and sold it off pretty quickly, went back to using an old GoLite Jam rucksack. While it’s a well built pack, something just never sat right with the fit, especially with the load transfer to hip belt.
I now own a HMG Southwest 3400 and the fit was immediately better; better load transfer, better hip belt feel. The HMG is very reminiscent of how my Jam felt- snug to the body, but now with some minimal stays and better load transfer to the hips. Generally, I prefer the HM to the Catalyst in that the construction is simpler, cleaner, and happens to fit me better.
End of the day, they’re different packs. Both work, both are well made, but it really comes down to personal fit/anatomy.
Aug 27, 2016 at 2:41 pm #3422977Thanks Wisner. What’s your average load? Under 30?
Aug 27, 2016 at 3:09 pm #3422987Under 30 for 6 days including food. Base usually varies from 9-14.
Don’t get me wrong, the Catalyst is a good pack, I just had fit issues. I know there are those that swear by them. I think I also prefer the aesthetics/design of the HMG but that’s more subjective.
Aug 27, 2016 at 3:47 pm #3422992ULA’s hip belt to pack connection is very flexy. I have a Circuit which is the same design. Personally I don’t feel going much further north than 30lb is ideal with this design. Strictly based on weight to hip transfer, the pack itself is certainly sturdy enough for that weight or more. I will be modding my Circuit belt with a thin plastic sheet and a coupler to accommodate the single aluminum stay. Alternatively you could use a SMD belt with the ULA pack and add the coupler to the SMD belt as it is already quite stiff (maybe too stiff). I like the flex design but I really think ULA packs would be well served with a bit stiffer belt and a direct connection to the stay’s.
Aug 27, 2016 at 5:10 pm #3423008Of the two, I’d probably go with the HMG just because I feel it carries better.
Not on your list, but I would also highly recommend the Katabatic Gear packs. I own the Artemis and have been extremely happy with the fit, carry, and features on trips that require a bear can.
Aug 27, 2016 at 5:26 pm #3423011Aaron – how’s the back warmth on he Katabatic.mit seems to have modest venting channels. I feel things warming up with the Catalyst as soon as I put it on.
Aug 27, 2016 at 8:57 pm #3423050Aaron, I hadn’t considered Katabatic. Very nice looking packs! Anybody else use one?
Aug 27, 2016 at 10:05 pm #3423068At some point, of course, you’ve got to try them on for yourself to really know, but here’s my experience. I’ve got two Catalysts and would fight to the death anyone who tried to take them away. I’ve had one that’s a tad too small for 8 years and consider it far and away the most comfortable and stable pack I’ve ever worn. I finally bought the larger size this year out of fear that ULA would quit making the pack before my other one wore out and it’s even more comfortable, especially with a fuller, heavier load. I typically hike at 27 to maybe 35 lb, depending on food and water load. I wouldn’t hesitate to go to 40 and disagree with the comment above that the hipbelt connection is unstable.
I’ve never worn the HMG and can’t comment on its comfort/ride, but it looks like a bladder-only pack. Don’t know if that works for you, but as a bottle man myself, I find the Catalyst pockets the best I’ve ever used–easy to retrieve and return while wearing the pack, big enough for two bottles each if you need it, and I’ve never had a bottle fall out.
Aug 27, 2016 at 11:23 pm #3423080The back warmth/sweat issue is on par with other packs I’ve used (of note, the HMG is the worst in this regard). The foam used dries quickly and does allow for a bit of venting, but I haven’t noticed a huge difference one way or the other.
Aug 28, 2016 at 7:01 am #3423103Thanks
i had a feeling it would be. It’s a pretty flat surface still and there’s not much ventilation coming through those channels.
Aug 28, 2016 at 7:33 am #3423105My wife, myself, and one of our hiking partners each have Catalyst’s. We all really like ours, but it’s critical to get a good fit bending the stays to fit ones back. Not everyone knows how to do this well (it takes some real work and actual weight in the pack)… I suspect this is a primary reason for negative feedback.
We recently did a week in the Beartooth with ours, mine started at 38lbs and was fine.
Aug 28, 2016 at 7:44 am #3423107Thanks Brad. You know that stay bending thing seems a require a lot of art. Any pointers on how to?
Aug 28, 2016 at 10:15 am #3423124For the weight of the Catalyst…look into the SeekOutside Divide
Aug 28, 2016 at 10:16 am #3423125Unless the Catalyst hip belt connection is unique to the line which I’m pretty sure it isn’t, the connection to the bag is indeed unstable in fact based on conversations with Chris that is a core philosophy of the design. Whether that flexibility is something you like or not will ultimately depend on you. Bending the stay would not affect the nature of the belt to bag connection. These things; like a lot of things are extremely personal. So I’ll suggest what others have to me when I asked recently on here and ended up with a Circuit. Buy both and return the one you don’t like after a test run with your bag packed as you would on a trip. :) I tested 9 bags…
I should also say I really like the flexibility in the Circuit up to a certain weight but beyond that it gets saggy butt syndrome. I just think a very simple modification as I described would be a great innovation to the design, that would still maintain that flexibility, in the Circuit anyways, as the single centre stay would still allow the belt to shift up and down as one walks.
Aug 28, 2016 at 11:05 am #3423132Respectfully, I’ll disagree with Michael’s opinion that the Catalyst has a flexible connection to the hipbelt in comparison to the Circuit. I found the connection on the Catalyst presumably because of the stiffer back panel/double stay connection.
I hiked the JMT in 2015 with my Catalyst and had a TPW around 33# coming out of MTR and I found the load “comfortable” although I’m never happy with the weight that high.
Echoing other comments above, bending stays and sizing is critical to comfort with ULA packs based on my experience. Both of my ULA packs required mailing packs back and forth until I found a good fit.
Aug 28, 2016 at 11:08 am #3423133I should also say I prefer my Circuit and ended up selling the Catalyst. After the JMT I realized I was carrying way too much of everything and simplified my kit. I don’t need that much gear any more.
Aug 28, 2016 at 11:55 am #3423143Finding the “best” pack has been the bane of my BP’ing life. Since 2009 I must have tried 20+ models. I really wanted to like the Catalyst and the Porter (in my case the 3400), but neither quite did it for me – for very different reasons though.
I normally take a Medium torso, but I think I was just on the cusp with ULA. A large may well have fit me better. I will echo others’ comments, that I just wasn’t able to get the weight transfer to my hips, and anything over 25lb was uncomfortable. Which shouldn’t have been the case. I couldn’t quite put my finger on why, but the descriptions of the hipbelt’s flex could be why.
HMG’s packs have gone through many revisions in a short while. My Porter was probably 3rd generation. I felt that it carried really well with the volume at 3400 cu in/ 55 litres. But I was concerned that the stitching wouldn’t last near the shoulder strap attachment points at continuous use of 30lb +. Perhaps they’ve rectified that on newer models. For anything larger, I’d want a frame rather than just stays. The Seek Outside Divide was on my shortlist, but I wound up going with a McHale, which I’m testing out now.
Aug 28, 2016 at 12:05 pm #3423147Probably taking this on a tangent, but I really don’t know what other people expect in packs. It’s so subjective that discussion becomes almost pointless at a certain stage because it is so dependent on personal preference.
I expect to sweat, no matter what’s on my back. The thought of a “hot pack” has never even occurred to me, and I’m a desert hiker. So it’s interesting hearing people talk about back panels and air flow.
As for load-transfer perfection and carrying comfort…Achieving a reasonably good fit is one thing, but I also resigned myself long ago to the fact that a bunch of weight on your back is never going to feel all that good. One pack will rub a bit here, another pack will rub a bit there.
Overly high expectations will plunge you down a rabbit hole…not that pack manufacturers will mind taking your money in the quest.
Aug 28, 2016 at 2:07 pm #3423184Clearly lots to think about; or lots that I could think about. Comfort is a huge factor for me. I hate the idea of sending packs back and forth, but in the end, unless I go big name and heavier that’s probably what I’ll have to do.
Aug 29, 2016 at 10:03 am #3423367@xmomanx
This is exactly what I think. I understand if one sweats excessively that ventilation is a major concern but I expect to have a sweaty back.
For 5 days my pack fully loaded with food, water, gear, … ranges from 20-25lbs depending on the trip and whether I need a bear can so load hauling comfort above 28lbs isn’t a concern. I dreaded the few times I’ve been above 30lbs.
Besides the actual size and features meeting my needs the most important aspect is the fit. I think it’s a lot to expect everything from 1 pack. I have a 3 pack quiver.
-Frameless: 1-2 night trips without a bear can or special needs like needing to carrying large amounts of water or additional layers. 18lbs and below. ~20% of backcountry days. Currently an MLD Burn
-Go to pack: Used for the majority of my trips. 18-28lbs. ~70% of backcountry days. Currently an HMG 2400 Windrider.
-Load Hauler: Used for family trips with my kids. Also, will be used for winter trips if those ever happen. 28lbs+. ~10% of backcountry days. Currently a first gen SMD Fusion 65.
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