The Sawyer Mini may not be the best filter

[Nick D]

“My entire 2L gravity setup is now ~5.5 oz. Not sure how much more there is to say :)”

JCH – Don’t want to deviate from the OP, but I’m curious what bag you’re using. 5.5oz is great.

[JCH]

Repurposed and stripped down Platy 2L Big Zip SL and (shortened) hose, filter, mesh bag and sawyer connection adapter. Note that this created a closed system so much less chance of contaminating the clean side with drips/splashes.

[Nick D]

I like that a lot. Thank you.

And thanks David for starting this thread. I’ve had all kinds of trouble with my mini. Time to make a change.

[Tony Wong]

Dave,

Great thread that you have going on here.

The “Black Filter” was simply the Original Sawyer Inline filter….Dave has the time line right about when it was sold, and then replaced by the Squeeze and then Mini.

Back then you could by the Black Filter as a stand alone product….some with a faucet connector to be used at home to back flush/clean the filter.

There was a version that was larger and filtered viruses, but my understanding is that it required a lot of pressure or suction to get working, so I don’t know of anyone who used that filter for backpacking.

The Sawyer Lexan water bottle simply had the Black filter connected at the end of the sipping straw inside the bottle. (Oddly, I have one of these bottles, but only bought it for the purpose of getting my hands on an “extra” Black Filter.

With the Black filter I used a Platypus 0.5 oz filter link, which was simply a threaded connector to attach the water bottle to the nipple for the inline filter….basically, I made my own squeeze/mini.

Curiously, Platypus stopped selling these filter links when they brought out there own gravity filter…..perhaps as a way to prevent people from making their own gravity filter???

https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/13450/

Above is the link to the original review that I wrote up in 2008….the photos that illustrated my setup have been stripped out when the new BPL website software was put into place. (It was a nightmare to find the review….essentially lost to time now because it is not organized by review by named product….mess.

Anyway, I agree that the Black filter should provide a better/faster rate of flow/experience as a gravity filter. It has a larger diameter and therefore more surface area for filtering water vs. the mini. Likely lighter than the Squeeze….my review notes shows that the Black filter was 1.80 oz dry.  (I don’t really care about the wet weight because the water that is left in the filter is eventually going to be used by me…so call it micro water storage).

The advantage of the design of the Squeeze and mini is that the built in threads allow for using the filter for squeezing vs. the Platypus filter link that I was using….easier design at the expense of a heavier shell/body.

The only negative that I have seen with the Black filter is that I had a friend snap off one of the nipples….which is likely NOT to happen with the Squeeze or Mini due to the shortened length of the input /output nipples.

I have been a little frustrated by the flow rate of the mini and now that Dave has brought this subject up, I might go back and try out the Black filter.

My current setup is using a Wide Mouth Soft Side 1.0 L Nalgene Canteen with a Blue Desert Smart Tube Hydration system with the Sawyer mini at a mouth piece at the end of my drinking tube….slipping a Camelback bite piece on the output of my mini’s nipple so it does not leak.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Blue-Desert-SmarTube-Hydration-System/dp/B000GM6LWS/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1464143067&sr=8-7&keywords=hydration+tube

However, in camp, I do prefer to Squeeze filter my water vs. using a gravity filter….simply faster.

Anyway, just my few cents and observations on the matter.

What I would like to see is a redesign of the Squeeze to reduce the weight and bulk of the exterior shell…perhaps just replacing the Squeeze with a larger diameter Mini, using the same design.

Tony

[Yoyo]

@JCH

I like your setup.  I’m curious–how much does the Big Zip weigh sans cordage, and how did you remove the heavy plastic thingy?  Also, how LONG is your dirty tube?  I have a very similar setup, except that I use a regular 2L Platy bladder (to save weight).  I used to use a similar 4L bladder that came with the Platy Clean Stream kit (designed for their gravity filter) and has a female quick disconnect built in, and still do if I’m travelling with my wife, but for myself the 2L Platy saves weight.   The advantage of the Big Zip / CleanStream dirty bag is the ease of filling it.  The advantage of the 2L Platy is that you can safely transport 2.5 L of water in your pack for dry stretches.  I use a 2L Platy for my clean drinking water and a hydration tube.  Total weights of both of our systems are very comparable.

The weights of my system components are as follows:

2L dirty Platy bag with hang cord = 34 g

DIY Screw on cap with female quick disconnect attachment = 12 g

26″ long dirty Platy tubing with male quick disconnect = 33 g

Weight of Sawyer Black filter with male barb attachment to link to clean hydration tube = 74 g

Total weight of system = 153 g (5.4 oz)

[Yoyo]

@Tony

Nice to see that you are still around and thanks for your input on the thread.  I think you probably recall that we’ve both been exchanging ideas on this Black filter for some time now–maybe going back to at least 2009 or so?  It’s funny that we both have considered going back to this old system after all these years.  This 2009 thread shows the development of my thoughts on the matter:

https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/21537/

I’m curious why you prefer squeezing over gravity filtration in camp.  A couple years of ago, I started using the Sawyer mini hoping to save half an ounce or so.  They were cheap, so why not?  Maybe I just got a bad unit, but squeezing it with cold fingers was not fun at all.  I quickly reverted back to gravity fed systems after one trip.  With my current system, I sit down and do nothing.  The male barb attaches right to my clean Platy tubing and I don’t even have to remove my bladder from my pack if I don’t want to.  (I normally do, though).

I will say that the flow rate while on the trail isn’t as stellar as it is while at home.  Nevertheless, I still think it’s pretty good.  The Mini was so bad that it took about an hour to filter my water.

I plan to do a follow up video on my entire system.  Stay tuned…

[JCH]

David,

big zip is 2.04 oz. and hose is 28″. The big zip’s big plastic retaining clip is just held on with a bit of shock cord…easily untied and removed.  I like the zip-lock opening and the self-sealing hose connection.

[Andrew Priest]

Very interesting discussion. I have a Sawyer Squeeze which I would like to re-purpose as a gravity filter given the prices by the looks of going to a black filter. I will put up with the extra bit of weight.

Curious as whether the Squeeze would work okay as a gravity filter and if anyone has an idea of the flow rate (say one litre of water).

Thanks.

[JCH]

Andrew,

The Squeeze and the “black filter” are very similar in performance. I replaced the Squeeze in my gravity system with the black filter simply for the small weight savings and the simpler connections (eliminated a couple of sawyer attachment pieces and some tubing). The Squeeze worked great in my gravity system, you should have no problems using it as such.

[Art …]

What criteria are you using in your definition for ” Best Filter ” ?

by the criteria I use, no Sawyer product qualifies as “Best”.

[Jim C]

Art, what are your criteria?

[Art …]

”  Art, what are your criteria?  ”

I am a fastpacker so my criteria may differ from yours.

weight is important but secondary to the following :

1. as indestructible as possible, meaning it won’t be damaged by freezing or excess heat, and it won’t be easily damaged by rough handling.

2. it must be fast, meaning fast setup and fast drinkable water yield time. for me this criteria eliminates tablets.

3. it must be a system or device that can fill a 20 oz bottle, meaning no drinking straws.

like  I said, your criteria may be different from mine.

but you can’t just claim something is best without defining the criteria of evaluation.

[Jim C]

Art, by those criteria, what solution have you found that works for you?

Droplets should be indestructible (provided you’ve repackaged them from a glass container), and while faster than tablets, still aren’t fast.

Pump filters are relatively fast (or so I understand; I’ve never used one myself), but aren’t they also susceptible to damage by freezing or dropping? MSR Guardian claims it can withstand freezing and drops from six feet onto concrete, so it may be the most robust solution.

Steripen is fast, but far from indestructible. The first and only Steripen I’ve owned (Ultra) gave up the ghost on the first trip. While it was convenient while it worked, I’m just not willing to take that risk again.

Products comparable to Sawyer filters—such as Lifestraw and Platypus—seem to have the same drawbacks as Sawyer’s. I’m intrigued by RapidPure, but it, too, warns against freezing.

Incidentally, I haven’t made any claim that something is best; I’m just trying to learn from other people’s experiences and choices, which is why I find input from you and others valuable.

[Tony Wong]

Just a little information:

The Lifestraw…unless they have made a change in their product, has a much smaller pore size and therefore cannot filter out as much as the Sawyer.

My understanding is that because of this the Life Straw it is not suitable for backpacking…where there are other filters that do a “better” job….such as the Sawyer Mini.

The Platypus gravity filter uses the same plastic hollow tube/fiber technology as the Sawyer….I just believe that the Platypus gravity filter and filter itself are are heavier than the Sawyer.

Rapid Pure uses a different type of technology all together and looks like it can strain out chemicals as well as biological contaminates. It also looks like it would have a faster rate of filtering.

http://www.rapidpure.net/resources/RP%20Revised%20Filter%20Life%20Document.pdf

The possible downside to the Rapid Pure is that the filter must be replaced where the Sawyer can be restored by back flushing.

RapidPure vs. Sawyer…..really different types of filters in that the Sawyer cannot remove chemicals. The Sawyer is more economical due to its ability to be back flushed and restored to “factory new” status. With the RapidPure, you might have to carry an replacement filter if you have problems on the trail.

Just some differences.

@Dave

I am likely to continue with the Mini or possibly get the Squeeze because in camp, I am not using a gravity filter and therefore need to “squeeze” a dirty bag of water to have water for my meals.

The Mini and Squeeze are better suited for both inline and squeezing where the Black filter needs adapters that are no longer sold by Platypus to connect to a water bottle/Platypus/Evernew to squeeze filter water.

Tony

[jscott]

“How do you define ‘best”?

For hiking solo…I love my steripen. But then I don’t carry a platypus full of water when hiking, just drink from a bottle.

It’s light, no hassles, no clogs. I’ve never had an issue with mine. Much better than my old squeeze bottle filter.

[Yoyo]

To me, the primary criteria in a filter are:

1. Reliability
2. Low weight
3. Ease of use
4. Removes bacteria and protozoa

I think the Black Sawyer filter satisfies these criteria best.  Of course, there are always tradeoffs.  The Sawyer Mini is about 16 g lighter if I recall correctly (check the video for my exact measurements) when wet.  But I think the questionable reliability keeps it from winning 1st prize.  As for “most durable” filter (surviving freezing, etc.), I don’t think that’s an advantage.  I don’t plan to drop my filter on a rock from 6 feet high, nor do I plan to leave it in a snowbank overnight.  If temps drop below freezing, I store the filter in my sleeping bag overnight.  As with all UL equipment, some care must be exercised. But if used properly, the Sawyer filter should last a lifetime for most (this assumes proper sanitization, backflushing, etc.).  If it does break, it’s cheap enough to replace fairly easily at about $30-35 a piece (even less for the Mini).

[Andrew Priest]

Thanks JCH. I will have to get it out on the weekend and look at the best way I can setup it for as little weight as possible.

[JCH]

Andrew, here is a photo of my system prior to replacing the squeeze with the black filter and eliminating the extra BigZip SL parts. This was also a closed system, which I really like. The piece on the far right is two platy bottle caps glued together with a large hole drilled through to create a female-female adapter with which to connect the clean bottle. Also shown is the (optional) carbon filter for those trips where the water may be stinky or have an unpleasant taste…this component also works with the new striped down version pictured in my previous post. Everything is more or less modular so the system can be tailored to the trip expectations.

[Andrew Priest]

Thanks JCH. Most helpful.

[Jim C]

JCH,

Are you able to use your system to fill directly into a rigid water bottle (e.g., Smartwater), or does that not work because the air can’t vent out? Maybe if the cap is screwed on loosely it will vent?

[JCH]

I filter directly into a 2L soft Platy bottle so, as long as I start with it completely collapsed don’t have any venting problems, but yes, if filling rigid bottles you can simply leave the cap a little loose.  I think the air rushing out will retain the vast majority of the benefit of my “closed system”.

[Dean F.]

Just wanted to point out that the larger Sawyer filters have been around since at least 2007.  Here are some old BPL reviews, including my own.  You’ll note that I bemoan that so few people know about these wonderful filters.  The issue was that at first Sawyer was marketing to the humanitarian/third world traveler crowd and it wasn’t until the Mini and the Squeeze that they started aggressively marketing to the outdoorsy crowd.

[JCH]

Very interesting thread on the new Katadyn filter.  I love the innovation, especially the skeletonized casing, but I’m not seeing anything that makes me want to re-engineer my current gravity system.

Would love to hear from anybody considering ditching their sawyer system in favor of the Katadyn, and why?

[KRS]

I have the Mini and its not as fast as the squeeze but the flow is good and when it slows a quick back flush and its as good as new. My system is a closed gravity system for camp use and weighs 5 oz. I also use the filter while hiking with one clean Smartwater bottle and one dirty Smartwater bottle. The filter is stored on the dirty bottle. In camp I will set it up as a gravity set up. Then quick connecter is valved so I can carry extra water in the Evernew 2L container if needed. Now after looking at the pics you will see there is a lot of reengineering of the filter and pieces.

[JCH]

Kurt – Sawyer should redesign the Mini as you have modified it…threads on both ends.

[Author]

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