Sep 16, 2020 at 6:22 pm #3676429Daryl and DarylBPL Member
@lyrad1Locale: Pacific Northwest, USA, Earth
This is the most depressing film I’ve seen in a long time. If the virus, fires, politics and economy haven’t done you in this may.
Here’s a summary. SPOILER ALERT
Over population is the primary problem with global climate change. Too many people consuming too much stuff. Nothing we’ve done in the last 30 years has helped and most of what we have done made things worse (solar this and that, windmills, green energy, etc. ). There isn’t much hope for turning things around. The very end shows some unfortunate orangatangs (sp?) who have lost their habitat and are dying in a dead tree. It will make you cry. Pretty much confirms what Limits of Growth concluded in the 1970s.Sep 16, 2020 at 6:29 pm #3676432Ken ThompsonBPL Member
@hereLocale: Right there
Pandemics may prove useful thenSep 16, 2020 at 7:14 pm #3676438Jerry AdamsBPL Member
@retiredjerryLocale: Oregon and Washington
This one doesn’t have big enough fatality rate to be useful;Sep 16, 2020 at 9:34 pm #3676460
I saw that movie. And the end with the orangutans was horrifying. The stuff of the worst nightmares. I think I’m going to be sick just remembering it.Sep 17, 2020 at 5:24 pm #3676604
Okay it’s the next day. Thanks a lot for the nightmares last night. And all I had to do was remember the movie, not even watch it again.
It reminds of a movie I saw in school as a kid. In that movie, there was no narration. There were images of somewhere in Florida. Then a bulldozer comes through and people light the vegetation on fire and little baby birds in their nest, maybe ducklings, are burned up. All these years later I have never forgotten that movie.Sep 19, 2020 at 7:44 am #3676781
“Over population is the primary problem
with global climate change.”
Not so sure about that one. For a start, some of the more densely inhabited nations are facing significant population loss; Japan and Korea for example. Japan is an aged country, with I believe 30% of the population aged over 60 (over 70?). In Korea, an aging country, the birth rate is at an all time low. A recent estimate of global population I read had the global population peaking in about 2050 from memory, maybe earlier, then dropping.
I suspect the primary problem is more likely to be over-development, than over-population. Too high a standard of living for too many; so the (for me) frightening scenario of Chinese car ownership and use skyrocketing, with the associated increase in pollution, increasing use of land for transport corridors, and the consequent effects on the environment. Just the incredible scale of the trend and of its effects were what concerned me. Then the Indian scenario, where its population is projected to exceed China’s soon, with enormous growth in the middle class. General consumption skyrocketing.
India struck me as workable poverty for the masses, at least many years ago (1973; 1984); it was possible to live dirt cheaply, and enjoy life, and travel widely throughout the country. Poverty was seen as in a sense holy. The Saddhu; and even the “Sky Clad”, who wandered clothed only by the sky, traveling thousands of miles on foot, given alms, tolerated, supported, even celebrated. Maybe that has changed, or is changing with development, I expect radically.
Image attribution: Brian Hoffert
https://www.world-religions-professor.com/digambara.htmlSep 19, 2020 at 9:16 am #3676787
The Saddhu are a trip. The first place outside the US I ever visited was Nepal and they have them there.
I met an American saddhu here once, sort of in a way. He was this man who was walking around with a big sign that said “Walking to Cure Cancer” and with his giant walking staff and the way he looked, he sort of looked like a magic wizard. I hung out with him at a coffee house in Mammoth Lakes and talked to him and he told a story of wearing a suit and making lots of money and then he got cancer and it cost him a million dollars and as a result he lost his house and everything so he decided to just quit fighting and get rid of everything and just walk. I realized “Walking to Cure Cancer” was quite literal. He was walking as a cure to what cancer had done to him.
I have been thinking for a while, and even started a topic here somewhere with it in the title, that a lower standard of living might be much more free and happy. I have always lived with a fairly low standard of living, at least as far as Americans go, not having ever had children or purchased a house or been in debt or been beholden to conspicuous consumption. Until recently, I still owned the truck my dad bought me when I graduated college, but I sold it and now don’t own any car, just a motor scooter. But I have too much crap: too many clothes that I haven’t gotten rid of and don’t wear, so many musical instruments it’s ridiculous, too many bicycles, so much backpacking gear and a lot of general crap that I use to fix things and make things. I wish I could let go of this stuff but I keep putting it off.
Before Covid I used to drive into work and I’d pass this area with all these large raptors that liked to perch on light posts to survey their territory and I’d look at them and think how amazing it would be to be a living creature that literally never carried around anything at all but could manage to eat and sleep and raise a family and do all the things necessary to be a bird and never feel want for “stuff”. How would that feel?Sep 20, 2020 at 4:56 am #3676841
Palitana Jain Temples
“… for a Jain monk… … to renounce meant to renounce all attachments and bindings, including the emotion of shame at ones nakedness from having no possessions – not even clothes…”
On one of my trips to Japan, I met and befriended a Japanese man who was walking throughout the country. He carried a pack, and pulled a trundler. We travelled together briefly, re-meeting after I had bused and he had walked. Interesting chap to chat with. Occasionally he would work at temporary jobs to earn a little subsistence money, he told me. He declared he would have no problem in being killed and eaten by a bear, wolf, or other wild creature; he would be glad in his dying to have his death help another soul survive…Sep 20, 2020 at 8:48 am #3676849
I’m curious about that movie. When I saw it, it was right after Stephen Colbert announced it on his show. It was so strange the way he sort of mic-dropped it with this weird smile on his face. And the movie itself is sort of out-of-character even for Michael Moore. Moore’s films usually have more hope or make you want to take action beyond curling up in a ball and praying not to have nightmares. But I never could get that weird smile of Colbert’s out of my mind.
In the mean time, 2020 has sort of proven to me that we’re not going to get ourselves out of this problem no matter what we do and the weird premonition I’ve always had about my old age is that it will probably be worse than I ever imagined. I only imagined personal suffering, not global suffering.Sep 20, 2020 at 6:12 pm #3676896
Yes, the crises seem to be becoming both entrenched, and culminating. Their denial looks to be increasingly untenable. Not an easy time to witness.
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