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Guyline for Tarp that won't slip


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Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 26 total)
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  • #3394634
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    I just purchased the Gossamer Gear C-Twinn tarp.  The supplied guyline is too slick and slips when I put any significant amount of tension on the line.  Asking for suggestions to either make the line less slick so that it will hold or suggestions for better guyline that doesn’t slip.

    The line locs I am using are these http://gossamergear.com/line-lock-8pack.html

    The guyline that it came with is http://gossamergear.com/ezc-2-tarp-guyline.html

    #3394645
    Nick Gatel
    BPL Member

    @ngatel

    Locale: Southern California

    I am no expert on LineLocs and don’t know if there are different sizes (e.g., 2 vs 3). All the ones I have say they will work with 2mm line and they slip with several brands of line. I went to 3mm and no more slipping.

    #3394665
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    Yes… that’s my experience too… I think you’ll need 3mm line for that particular line lock. or get the micro line locks

    billy

    #3394668
    Clifford Deakyne
    BPL Member

    @cliffdeakyne

    Locale: Colorado Rockies foot hills

    Channeling “eric c”, if you want to use the line that you have, replace the line locks with a Blakes Hitch.

    #3394675
    Dylan Atkinson
    BPL Member

    @atkinsondylan

    Locale: Southwest

    Or, just put a slippery half hitch so the line wont slip. Hell, put two in if the weather looks bad.

    #3394694
    James holden
    BPL Member

    @bearbreeder-2

    Keep the line locks but tie back the tails to the guyline with a blakes hitch

    no slip guaranteed

    ;)

    #3394924
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    I ended up using the Taut Line Hitch.  I used the directions on this site http://www.cascadedesigns.com/msr/blog/best-camping-knot-tie-taut-line-hitch-knot/

    I am normally pretty bad with knots and the knowledge of them but is a pretty easy knot to remember and it worked fantastic!!  Forget the Line Locs altogether.  Easy to adjust, holds tight.  Very happy.

    #3395091
    Joe Lynch
    BPL Member

    @rushfan

    Locale: Northern California

    I like Andrew Skurka’s method a lot and his explanation is great.

    http://andrewskurka.com/2012/tarp-guyline-system/

    #3395092
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    The thing I didn’t like about Andrews method is that it wastes line because you have fully double back the line before finishing with the slippery half hitch.  That presents problems for corner and side lines that are much shorter.  Using the taut line hitch can use most of the line length if desired.

    #3395097
    Matthew / BPL
    Moderator

    @matthewkphx

    True although you can just do a trucker’s hitch if Skurka’s variation ends up being short on a specific pitch.

    #3395102
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    “Forget the Line Locs altogether”

    Line Locks are better when you have really cold fingers.

    Very hard to tie and untie those knots when the fingers won’t work.

    (everything has is pluses and minuses :)

    billy

    #3395106
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    No need to untie the knot at all.  Just lift the loop off the stake and pack the tarp way.

    #3395119
    Nick Gatel
    BPL Member

    @ngatel

    Locale: Southern California

    I added linelocs to all my shelters except two that had them. Lot of convenience for little weight, especially since I bring few other convenience items. As Billy said, much easier when your fingers are cold. Quicker and easier to adjust in the middle of the night if needed, especially with a single wall shelter where you usually can reach out and adjust without getting out of you bag or quilt. They’re not for everyone obviously.

    #3395139
    Roger Caffin
    BPL Member

    @rcaffin

    Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe

    Skurka’s hitchs are fine – there are others of course. The problem with Skurka’s photos is the angle between the stake and the string. The stake should be a bit more inclined, at right angles to the string, for best holding power. (imho)

    Cheers

     

    #3395149
    Jim Colten
    BPL Member

    @jcolten

    Locale: MN

    Guyline for Tarp that won’t slip?

    Won’t would be a rather high standard if it means “will not ever” but the trucker’s hitch comes pretty close to that.

    Having said that, convenience does have value and cold fingers don’t work as well as warm fingers.

    Linelocs will slip but can be made considerably less slippery by backing them with “Shurka’s” slippery hitch (aka slippery half hitch) and you can decide to add the extra hitch or not depending on conditions and exposure at the time.  With a little bit of practice the slippery half hitch can easily be tied wearing gloves … mitts make it a lot harder.

     

     

     

    #3395155
    James holden
    BPL Member

    @bearbreeder-2

    the blakes hitch will NOT slip unless you are using unusually slick coated lines … with the dyneema core and poly/nylon sheath lines it wont slip before your tie outs get ripped

    ive personally tested the blakes to 40+ lbs on ~2mm lines …. the tautline slips at ~15-20 lb

    you only need to tie the blakes once … once its tied you leave it tied and simply adjust it up and down like a line lock

    if you do want to use a line lock, backing it up with a blakes hitch means you dont have to tie slippery hitches … you just leave it on and adjust it with the line loc

    ;)

     

    #3395183
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    @bearbreeder just looking at the Blakes vs Taut line hitch, they are basically the same but the Blake has two extra loops which makes sense for it’s extra holding power you experienced in your testing.

    #3395261
    IVO K
    BPL Member

    @joylesshusband

    Locale: PA lately

    …Blakes vs Taut line hitch, they are basically the same but the Blake has two extra loops…

     

    @ Randy:

    This is incorrect, and it is not kosher to mislead future readers of this thread.

    The Blake’s and the Tautline hitches are not at all “the same” and the difference is not “two extra loops” as you pit it.

    #3395266
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    @joylesshusband, Looking at the two finished knots, Blakes has really just one extra loop (4 total) but the end line feeds under two of the loops to give it a more secure finish, more friction in the sliding and more holding power it would appear.  Whereas the Taut line has 3 loops with the end line feeding under one of those loops and so what appears to be a less secure knot but easier to tie and perfectly functional.

    Not trying to “mislead” anyone.  I am pretty sure anyone looking to tie those knots won’t be looking at this thread to learn that.  In the future you really should avoid projecting intentions onto people.

    To ensure no one is mislead, here is a nice animation of both of those knots.  Note that the Taut line hitch is an alternative name to the Midshipman’s Hitch.

    http://www.animatedknots.com/blakes/#ScrollPoint

    http://www.animatedknots.com/midshipmans/#ScrollPoint

    #3395281
    Chad B
    BPL Member

    @cenazwalker

    Locale: Southwest

    This is interesting.  I’ve used 2mm Lawson Glowire on a variety of shelters with LineLoc 3’s and never had them slip, even in high winds.

    I wonder if the sheath on the GG line is slicker/smoother than the Glowire?

    So how do you like the C-Twinn?  Seems like it’s a really good option for a cat cut tarp . . . low weight and priced quite reasonable in my opinion.

    #3395288
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    Haven’t had a chance to take the C-Twinn on a trip just yet but have setup a few times in the yard.  I previously owned the SpinnTwinn and so was quite comfortable/familiar with the pitch and the functionality of the catenary cut.  The weight of the C-Twinn is pretty amazing at just under 13oz including guylines and stuff sack.  I haven’t seam sealed the ridge yet so that will add less than 1oz.  But still, that is excellent weight for a non cuben duo sized tarp.  A couple of pics in the front yard.

    #3395310
    Chad B
    BPL Member

    @cenazwalker

    Locale: Southwest

    Are there any attachment points on the underside of the tarp such as along the ridgeline to attach a bivy?

    #3395313
    Randy Martin
    BPL Member

    @randalmartin

    Locale: Colorado

    There are two loops on the underside at each end of the ridge for that purpose but that is it.  I do wish they had a couple of extra about 1 foot from each end.  However, I just string my bug bivy straight to the main ridge pole at either end as shown in this this picture though I realize you can’t really see the detail in this picture but you get the idea.  That is the Yama Mountain Gear 1p Bug Shelter that I use.  http://www.yamamountaingear.com/bug-shelter-1p/

    #3395689
    Dana S
    BPL Member

    @naman919

    Locale: Richmond, Virginia

    For the better part of a decade I’ve been using the taut-line hitch, bowline, and clove hitch knots to secure my shelters. For guy-lines I would recommend the taut-line hitch, and in my experience, when tied properly, it does not slip. Note that there is a slight difference between the midshipman’s hitch and the taut-line hitch.

    TLDR: Ditch the LineLoc’s and use a taut-line hitch :]

    #3399993
    IVO K
    BPL Member

    @joylesshusband

    Locale: PA lately

    @ Randy M:

     In the future you really should avoid projecting intentions onto people.

    In the future you really should avoid inferring things which are simply not there… I never said you intended to mislead – what I said was that you actually are misleading the readers.

    And yet you continue to do so.

    The very second link you provided to illustrate your point (of the Tautline hitch), in fact proves mine and refutes yours. If one looked carefully what happens in slide 5, 6, 7 in that animation, one would notice that the second loop of this knot gets flipped in direction opposite to wounding the first loop, essentially forming the Awning hitch – unlike the way the second loop is wound in the Blake’s hitch – and this is precisely the big difference between the Blake’s and Tautline hitches.

    Dana’s post above mine provides another good link demonstrating this difference.

    It is quick for a person with attention to detail to realize the difference between these knots, Your inability to notice this distinction, on the other hand, places you outside of this category, which essentially makes you unqualified to comment on these knots.

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