Topic

Grand Canyon down to the river


Forum Posting

A Membership is required to post in the forums. Login or become a member to post in the member forums!

Home Forums General Forums General Lightweight Backpacking Discussion Grand Canyon down to the river

  • This topic is empty.
Viewing 18 posts - 1 through 18 (of 18 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #1315509
    Stinson 108
    BPL Member

    @stinson108

    So one of the things on my bucket list is hiking down to the river at the Grand Canyon N.P. Otherwise it's sort of a 3 hour park. Drive up, stare at the big hole, check out the visitors center and drive off. But I don't know if straight down and straight back up the mule trail is the right thing either. Any suggestions? Will be solo, I don't think I have time for Havasupi. I'm thinking late May before it gets stupidly hot. Sure would appreciate any tips.( Besides lots of water!)

    #2091641
    David Thomas
    BPL Member

    @davidinkenai

    Locale: North Woods. Far North.

    Late May CAN be stupidly hot. Or it might just be 90F. I got lucky with my 12-year-old in late May and 90F was the hottest we saw.

    What's the longest, stupidest hike you've ever done (location, vertical and horizontal)? That would help those of us who have done it many times relate to something you've done.

    It is a great hike and, maybe like you, I can't imagine going to GCNP and not hiking to the River and back.

    START EARLY!!!! 6 am is not early. 5 am is good. 4 am is better. (shift your sleep in advance so you are early AND well-rested). You want to get back before the heat of day really hammers you on the uphill climb. Also, you get the whole trail to yourself on the way down (no mules, very few other hikers). You'll see why that's nice as you head up and encounters the hoards near the Rim.

    First timer? Just do Bright Angel. More water stops, less steep than South Kaibab. Turn around anytime if needed. No need for a shuttle (required to go down SK and up BA, the other reasonable choice).

    CONDITION!!!! Not just on the horizontal miles but more so on the vertical. Do hill work until you don't notice that you're hiking uphill.

    That's about it. Start early. Condition beforehand. Bring lots of tasty calories. And $20 if you get to Phantom Ranch and want 3 glasses of lemonade, or some granola bars. Sun protection. I like a cotton shirt, hat and bandana that I can soak at the various water stops and stream crossings to cool off. Leave off one layer at the Rim at 5 am. Meaning, it will feel like you need a sweater when you start. You won't need it once you're 1/2 mile into the Canyon and you won't need it the rest of the day so just shiver a bit for 10 minutes at the start.

    Redfeather Lodge 10 miles south of the Rim is cheaper and has vacancies with less notice than the lodging in the Park.

    #2091647
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    Based on your questions, I think it likely you're one of the folks who should not attempt rim-river-rim in a day.

    To whit:

    -There are two major corridor trails on the South Rim which go to the river. Both are used by mules.
    -Late May is stupid hot at 2300'.
    -Havasupai is quite a ways from the main South Rim complex.
    -The cultural and historical activities on the South Rim are excellent. The tour of the Kolb house is one of the more interesting things I've done in a national park which did not involve a trail. The ranger lectures are also quite good.

    In late May I'd advise going to the North Rim, which is both more scenic and less crowded. The porch of the North Rim lodge is one of the great beer drinking locations on planet earth. Hiking the north Kaibab down to 5000' (view of Roaring Springs) and back is a great hike which will put the hurt on most folks. Or take three days, stay at Cottonwood both nights, and make it to the river on day two.

    #2091651
    Mobile Calculator
    Spectator

    @mobile-calculator

    #2091715
    David Thomas
    BPL Member

    @davidinkenai

    Locale: North Woods. Far North.

    >"Another point of interest is to get the map of reliable water sources and time your refills accordingly, so you don't carry excess water weight."

    Or not. If you go down and back on BA, just note if the two water stops above Indians are turned on as you descend past them. You could treat water from the stream crossings below Indian Gardens (I never do, but I use it to wet my shirt and bandana) or take enough for IG-River-IG.

    If you go down the SK and up the BA, you'll need enough water to get to Indian Gardens (unless you cross the River and get piped water near the raft landing spot or at Phantom Ranch (recommended). Leave with enough water to get to Indian Gardens. Ask anyone coming down to IG if the two spots are turned on before leaving IG.

    Short version: I slug down 1-2 quarts with breakfast. Carry none from the Rim. Drink a pint in Indian Gardens. Carry none (if I'm feeling strong and sure I'll make it to Phantom Ranch. Drink lemonade and water in Phantom Ranch. Depending on the temps and the time of day, I'd carry one or two quarts from Phantom Ranch towards IG. And, depending on the temps and time at IG and if the two upper spots are turned on, I'd carry 0 to 1 quart from IG.

    Full disclosure, in addition to the mule piss and out of shape hikers Roger correctly guarantees you'll see, you know you're 5 minutes from the Rim when you see someone in plaid polyester slacks and white patent-leather shoes. You'll be stinky, sweaty, and dirty and they'll know you did something they didn't/couldn't.

    #2091726
    Karl Keating
    BPL Member

    @karlkeating

    If you're thinking of a one-day hike in late May, forget it. If you do the South Kaibab/Bright Angel Trail loop, that's 16.3 miles with about 4,300 feet of elevation gain on the way out, in very hot weather.

    I've hiked all but one South Rim trail. Usually I don't go later than March, when crampons are needed at the top but most of the trail is free of snow and the temperatures at the river are mild. Once, as part of a group, I went in early May, and at the river it was 100 degrees. That was a multi-day hike. I wouldn't have considered trying to do it in one day in that heat.

    If you're stuck with late May, make it a two-day hike. Go down the South Kaibab–the only South Rim trail that's ridgeline all the way, making for great views. Take at least 3 quarts of water. Rest at Phantom Ranch (7.4 miles from rim), where you can down a few lemonades. Then you have two options.

    1. Start up the Bright Angel trail in the late afternoon, as the sun goes behind the rim. Your goal for the night is Indian Garden campground (5.1 miles/1,254-foot gain), where there is piped water. Bring a headlamp, in case you're slow on the trail. The second day, hike out in the relatively cool morning (4.8 miles/3,060-foot gain) and be to the top by noon.

    2. Stay the night at Bright Angel campground, which is next to Phantom Ranch (no reservation needed). On the second day hike up the Bright Angel trail (9.9 miles/4,314-foot gain), taking advantage of piped water at Indian Garden, Three-Mile Resthouse, and Mile-and-a-Half Resthouse.

    As fine as the views are from the rim, I think you can't appreciate the Grand Canyon unless you hike into its bowels. Doing the South Kaibab/Bright Angel loop provides you with samples of nearly all the kinds of scenery there.

    Don't worry about mule droppings on the Bright Angel trail. I've been on Sierra Nevada trails where the horse droppings were worse.

    When you reach the top, listen for one of the wranglers answering the perennial question, "Do the mules ever fall off the trail?" "No, ma'am, not even the blind ones."

    #2091727
    Karl Keating
    BPL Member

    @karlkeating

    David's post above reminded me of an incident on that early-May hike I was on.

    We went down the South Kaibab, spent the night at Bright Angel campground, and then spent a couple of days hiking up (and in) Phantom Creek. There is not much a trail in that side canyon; you have to walk in the creek itself for most of about six miles, occasionally climbing around waterfalls until you reach an impassable waterfall.

    When we got back to Phantom Ranch we stopped at the refectory for cool drinks. There were six of us, five men and a fourteen-year-old boy. Everyone else in the room had come down by mule and had stayed in the Phantom Ranch cabins. They were clean and sweet-smelling, and we were grimy, a bit bloody, and stinky.

    At we sat at the lumberjack tables, the boy looked around at the other diners. Then he leaned toward me and asked, "Sir, is it all right if I feel superior?" I replied, "Today, Ryan, you are superior."

    #2091981
    robert van putten
    Member

    @bawana

    Locale: Planet Bob

    Man, my wife and I did a four day Grand Canyon hike in February. Here is a write up of our trip.

    http://www.freesteader.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=11684

    It hit 75, maybe as high as 80 degrees in the sun down there. In May I bet it hits 105.

    If you have good knees and pack light I'd recommend going down South Kaibab. You can't beat it for views. All the other trails are in drainages, this was carved from a ridge.

    It will get hellishly hot, with little shade. Think about carrying a mylar covered umbrella, and take a gallon of water.

    Spend a night at Bright Angle camp at the bottom, you'll be wiped out by the decent. I know we were!

    Maybe hike to cottonwood for another night?

    And hike out on Bright Angle trail.
    Leave at first light, and spend another night at Indian Gardens.

    If you ain't a Desert Rat, do it next winter. Seriously.
    And do plan on spending as many nights down there as you can, this is not a trip to rush through because there is simply to much to see, and when the heck will you ever climb down again?

    #2092143
    Don Morris
    Member

    @hikermor

    Grand Canyon can be a three hour park if you so choose, but there is more than enough there for three lifetimes, easily. The discussion so far has centered on the BS/K trail system, which is routinely mobbed with extremely high numbers of hikers. If you have never entered the Canyon before, it is probably prudent to begin there, because Canyon hiking presents unique challenges.

    Once one has some experience,consider destinations like Grandview Mesa, Hermit Canyon(and trail), Thunder River, and many others. They are all reached on "unmaintained trails"and still require permits, I believe.

    Definitely get an early start. Years ago I assisted in the excavation of the trailside ruins that I believe Roger Dodger refers to. I started down the SK at 2:30 AM on a pleasant June night, and it was just about right, reaching the river and the ruins at 4;30, just as the sun was rising.

    Sitting around an off trail campfire, I listened as a couple of experienced cavers developed a very good case for GC containing more cave passage than is currently known at Mammoth Cave, the largest cave system in the world. As it is, the largest cave in Arizona lies in the GC.

    You can easily spend more than three hours there.

    #2092161
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    Valerie, I owe you an apology. I was trying to respond to your post on my (new) phone and instead accidentally deleted it, which the forum software cannot undo. Sorry.

    #2092324
    Ken Bennett
    Spectator

    @ken_bennett

    Locale: southeastern usa

    We stayed at the North Rim for a few days in mid June. On the middle day we hiked down to Roaring Spring and back, a 10 mile round trip. It was 37F at the top when we left (around 430am) and 105F at the spring. We spent a couple of hours hanging around the spring, then slowly made our way back to the top. It was a great trip, but I would not have wanted to hike any further down into the canyon and come back out the same day.

    We got back in time for a late dinner. Yeah, it's only ten miles, but it's not an easy ten miles.

    #2092564
    John Rowan
    BPL Member

    @jrowan

    If you're not absolutely set on going to the river, there is another route you can take which lets you see a lot more of the canyon than most of the popular "dayhike" routes, but gets rid of some of the logistics and effort involved in going all the way to the bottom. It's not all that dissimilar to the main corridor trail routes discussed above, but basically, you take the South Kaibab Trail down to the intersection with the Tonto Trail, then head across to the connection with the Bright Angel Trail at Indian Gardens, then back up and out of the canyon on the BA trail. It's about 13mi and lets you get a good feel for the canyon without going all the way in. (IIRC, it gets you within 1000-1500' of the river.)

    That said, most of the warnings people are giving about the full route still certainly apply. It can be plenty hot down there, even above the inner canyon, and the climb out is still nothing to sneeze at.

    #2094976
    Hamish McHamish
    BPL Member

    @el_canyon

    Locale: USA

    John said:

    "…basically, you take the South Kaibab Trail down to the intersection with the Tonto Trail, then head across to the connection with the Bright Angel Trail at Indian Gardens, then back up and out of the canyon on the BA trail. It's about 13mi and lets you get a good feel for the canyon without going all the way in."

    I did this very route (solo) as my first foray down into the Canyon. It was spectacular and the Tonto trail was completely deserted. Even the South Kaibab gets more traffic than the Tonto. It gave a really great experience of being down in the Canyon without taking on the heat risk of the inner canyon. After getting to Indian Garden I went out-and-back on the flat(ish) trail to Plateau Point which was wonderful. I waited for the afternoon shadow to envelop the side canyon then hiked back up on the Bright Angel trail. I ate the last of my food (a ripe plum) about 1/2 mile below the rim, and the double serving of ice cream at the rim was delightful.

    I would not voluntarily go down into the inner canyon in late May.

    #2095917
    Valerie E
    Spectator

    @wildtowner

    Locale: Grand Canyon State

    No Worries, David Chenault! By now, I forgot what I had posted, LOL. (Probably something about day hiking on various trails from the rim, and that it's NOT a 3-hour park!

    I've been in AZ for 9 years now, and I've got over 80 nights below the rim, 12 of them in June (clearly need my head examined!). All backpacking; mostly North Rim, often outside park boundaries (never done a rafting trip) — and I've STILL never seen Phantom Ranch!

    No matter what challenges (heat, critters, etc.) we've encountered, somehow Grand Canyon always made it worth our while.

    #2095965
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    Thanks Valerie; the iPhone and are still aren't getting along very well.

    I did the Tonto from South Kaibab to Hermit in August years ago. It was actually quite enjoyable. I brought a tarp, pad, and cotton sheet, hiked from 5-10 and 4-10 both days, and napped in canyons during the middle of the day. Heat like that is an interesting thing to behold.

    #2099342
    Stinson 108
    BPL Member

    @stinson108

    Thanks for all the input. I definitely did not mean down and back in one day. So the South Kaibab in and Bright Angel out sounds like what I wanted. Your campground tips and lemonade tips are much appreciated too. 105 isn't hot! You should landscape in Kansas in the summer. Swing a pick when it's 105 and the humidity is 80%!!! The most vertical trail I've done is down into Hemmed in Hollow (Ark) and out in the same day. Hurt like hell the next day. Not the Grand Canyon I know. I've hiked Grand Gulch and out Bullet in July. That was hot, but no humidity. Start early, nap in the afternoon and hike in the evening. Yes. I appreciate the other tips too. I don't see how to make rim to rim work if you are solo….unless you want to backtrack. Anyway thanks for the tips. I see now I should have posted in the trip planning forum. Will do that next time. Looks like this trip will be next year, I got permits for Buckskin Gulch so my daughter and I plan to do that instead. Lots of posts on here about that trip. This site is a true wealth of experience.

    #2099396
    Valerie E
    Spectator

    @wildtowner

    Locale: Grand Canyon State

    Let me know if you have questions about your up-coming trip — I did Wire Pass/Buckskin/Pariah a couple of years ago…

    #2099409
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    "You should landscape in Kansas in the summer. Swing a pick when it's 105 and the humidity is 80%!!!"

    Did that all through high school every summer in southern Ohio. One reason I don't live anywhere close anymore. ;)

Viewing 18 posts - 1 through 18 (of 18 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
Forum Posting

A Membership is required to post in the forums. Login or become a member to post in the member forums!

Get the Newsletter

Get our free Handbook and Receive our weekly newsletter to see what's new at Backpacking Light!

Gear Research & Discovery Tools


Loading...