e-nrg bio ethanol – avoid if you want your pots to be usable!!

[Harald Hope]

A while back I did a group buy so I could check out e-nrg 'bio ethanol' fuel, it sounded quite promising, and the website description of the product made it sound like it would be a very good alternative to things like Kleanstrip green or other primarily ethanol based denatured alcohols, virtually all of which are denatured with methanol.

http://www.e-nrg.com/about-us/

One thing leading to another, I didn't actually get around to testing the stuff I got until this week, and, after noting my hands and face were getting covered with thick oily soot after running some stove tests, finally I realized that the fuel simply does not work as an alcohol stove fuel.

I emailed their customer support, and he noted that it sounded like there's an incomplete combustion going on, and also sent me me the MSDS for the fuel, where I saw that it contains up to 10% isopropyl alcohol. I'm not a chemist, but I'm assuming that that alcohol fails to combust until it gets further up the flame, thus creating the pretty yellow colors the company's website shows on their fireplaces that burn this stuff.

I did a quick test to verify this and found that there was little soot if you held some foil above the end of the yellow flame, so this stuff should be crossed off your list of possible stove fuels, e-nrg does not suggest it's good for stove fuel, and I can confirm it's by far the worst I've ever tried. The sooting is easily an order of magnitude more than Kleanstrip green, which many here have correctly noted leaves a light soot residue (but believed me, if you saw the heavy soot left by e-nrg fuel, you'd never consider klean strip green dirty again, lol).

The customer service guy was reasonable, and pointed out that nowhere do they suggest that this is a good stove fuel, it's only for their fireplaces, and the stuff that makes the tops of the flames yellow is exactly what will blacken your pots horribly if you use it to try to cook with, so the only fault I'd note re e-nrg is that they don't clearly say that their fuel is denatured with isopropyl alcohol, but then again, they aren't selling it as a denatured alcohol in the first place.

So this is a live and learn thing, I'm sure the other people who went in on the buy have noticed this by now, but I'm just posting this so that a google search or a site search will show this thread.

For those who must know, here's the MSDS data:
Ethyl Alcohol: 90-100% (umm, why do they say 100%? it can't be 100% if it has 2 other ingredients)
Isopropyl alcohol: 5-10%
Methyl Ethyl Ketone: 1.0-5.0%

So the very most ethyl it can have would be 94% And my guess is, given the requirement for max yellowing, it's probably 85%, it certainly burned with noticeably less energy than kleanstrip green in my tests.

One has to scratch one's head when one sees such bad data, and it makes one wonder if any of the data is actually true, since simple math shows that their numbers are wrong and impossible.

One could comment on the 'green' part of their claims for their fuel if one wanted, this ethyl stuff is all made from industrial agribusiness corn feed stock, which uses a lot of industrial fertilizers, diesel, and natural gas to process the alcohol, creating what most informed commentators note is little better than a straight conversion from carbon based fuels to alcohol in terms of energy in to energy out, but that's going a bit off topic, but it is worth keeping in mind when one considers what is actually green.

Now to find a way to get that black soot off all my pots, heh. I'm also finding a new fondness for kleanstrip green, while it leaves a very light residue, it by no means leaves heavy soot that wipes off on your fingers at a touch. So a bit of perspective is helpful in such comparisons.

Happy hiking, wanted to get this information out there just on the off chance someone else might be tempted to try this stuff, don't do it, you'll have a heck of a time figuring out what to do with it, I guess you can put it on outdoor fireplaces, that's it!! I'll give the bottles to some friends who have outdoor fireplaces, it actually does burn pretty clean if you let the flames rise high without interrupting them with a pot bottom. And to the others who discovered this sad fact, no, it wasn't only you or your stove, I tested this on 3 distinct types of stoves, a cat can, basic design, several penny type stoves, and a basic flat cat stove. All sooted very heavily.

[Roger Caffin]

> Isopropyl alcohol: 5-10%
> Methyl Ethyl Ketone: 1.0-5.0%

That is NOT healthy!!!

Cheers

[Harald Hope]

No it is not.

It is worth noting that they appear to have constructed this specifically to create a tall yellow flame tip, and I'm guessing but I don't know that the isopropyl has different burning qualities than ethanol/methanol, which makes it combust more slowly as it rises up on the flame, thus forming that yellow tip. It has to come from somewhere, so that should be it. It has roughly the same boiling point though.

I believe this is the case, because I did a quick aluminum foil test to confirm the full burn vs imcomplete combustion notion, first holding it above the flame tip an inch or two, no soot, then closer, then the foil surface actually ignited from unburned fuel, which was interesting.

personally I'm unclear how they can market this as an indoor fuel, but maybe the combustion is fairly complete if you don't interupt the flame? Chemistry, physics, I guess would confirm that.

However what I can state with absolutely no doubt is that this is the worst stove fuel I have ever used, all other fuels now look good to me in comparison.

I believe however most of the other denatured alcohols contain some ketones, but I'm not up on the chemistry of the various types so I have no idea what is worse.

[David Gardner]

+1 on e-nrg as a lousy fuel for alcohol stoves. Doesn't burn clean and leaves soot all over the pots. Per the MSDS it is certainly no safer or healthier than KleanStrip SLX.

[Hikin’ Jim]

I wonder if it would work any better with a stove specifically tuned to burn isopropyl alcohol. I'll have to look at the OP's link and see if I can get some to experiment with.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

Try adding 10 to 15% water to the fuel, This can help calm down the flames. I would like to try this fuel out on an ISO-Clean stove. Jon

[Roger Caffin]

> isopropyl has different burning qualities than ethanol/methanol,
Yes – it creates a LOT more toxic byproducts.

> this is the worst stove fuel I have ever used,
Indeed. Try the following:
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/alcohol_fuels_part_one.html
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/alcohol_fuels_part_two.html

cheers

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