Jun 3, 2012 at 6:56 pm #1290665
I was in REI today to get a down bag for my wife and the staff member in the sleeping bag section did not have a clue what she was talking about.
I have heard from friends that this is common occurrence.
Have other folk come across this?
StephenJun 3, 2012 at 7:06 pm #1883707
@b-g-2-2Locale: Silicon Valley
Once in a while, the senior REI sales people are on duty, and you will get your questions answered properly. At other times, the junior sales people on duty had worked their last shift at Best Buy or Starbucks.
–B.G.–Jun 3, 2012 at 7:16 pm #1883712
That's what I kind of guessed Bob.
The Lady in question had a handheld computer and was checking the specs of the bag online, when I asked her the fill weight she told me is was 800 fill, I politely explained to her that was the quality of the down and then she said the website did not show the fill weight.
I was impressed that the REI own brand bag my wife went for had an EN rating.
:-)Jun 3, 2012 at 7:24 pm #1883715
@glacierramblerLocale: NW Montana
I have had good luck sending an email to their customer service/product reps, but I wouldn't trust the salespeople on the floor. I'm guessing here, but I imagine that the email responders have access to more information and training than the in-store people. Just a thought.Jun 3, 2012 at 7:58 pm #1883720
@justin_bakerLocale: Santa Rosa, CA
Yep… They seem to care more about hiring people with sales experience than people with gear experience.Jun 3, 2012 at 8:06 pm #1883726
@glacierramblerLocale: NW Montana
I don't want to be too hard on them. …Well, actually I do. I made a lot of bad decisions early in my gear purchasing thanks to REI marketing and salespeople with minimal to poor knowledge. I say educate yourself, and REI is a fine place to shop. I prefer to buy locally if I can, but on big ticket items that have uncertain outcomes (like my NeoAir XLite), I still shop there. Honestly, if it weren't for the 100% Guarantee which they actually back, I wouldn't shop there very often.Jun 3, 2012 at 8:29 pm #1883742
most of the other shops around here never mind MEC or REI couldnt tell you the fill weight either …. unless they bump it up to someone in their product development department or the manufacturer whose rep may not know it either
it is not a REI specific problem, at least REI generally put the fill weight on their web site for bags …
most people dont ask about fill weight …Jun 3, 2012 at 8:35 pm #1883745
@oiboyroiLocale: South West US
Having worked there myself a couple of years ago, I would say that the level of knowledge varies greatly by employee. They do try hire people with experience, but that can mean a lot of different things. Quite often a person who has cycling experience has to cover the camping department, or the like. In those cases they probably won't give you the best advice. Also, in my experience, many customers just don't care about the technical aspects of gear. The questions they ask are more like "will this keep me warm" or "is this waterproof". No technical knowledge is needed to answer those questions.Jun 3, 2012 at 9:51 pm #1883764
@verberLocale: San Francisco Bay Area
My experience with sales folks at REI is highly variable. There are people I have talked to who have deep experience and knowledge. There are also people who seem to know next to nothing… but they are friendly and try to be helpful :-) I have found asking them what was their favorite backpacking trip and why pretty quickly gives me a sense of what sort of experience they have.
–MarkJun 3, 2012 at 10:04 pm #1883766
@dondoLocale: Colorado Rockies
Some know gear and some don't. The worst are the ones who think they know but really don't. That said, I've met staff at my local REI who are LW/UL nerds like the folks on this site, and we've had a good time discussing some of the finer points of gear. I think the best strategy is to do your research online first, on blogs and sites like BPL, and then go into the store armed with your knowledge.Jun 3, 2012 at 10:27 pm #1883769
There is great irony in this thread for me.
Back in 1991 I was preparing to hike the Pacific Crest Trail.
A very wise REI employee recommended i NOT use Raichle Montagna Boots (at 5lbs a pair!) to hike the trail.
She said i would loose my toe nails.
Well.. I bought those boots anyways despite her advice.
I lost 9 toenails and the soles of my feet as well at mile 43 of the 2,665 mile trail.
18 years later i heeded the advice I got from that woman at REI, as well as a lot of info from Yogi's guide, and the internet, and Ray Jardine.. I completed the trail in 2009 with almost pristine feet.
The point is.. I could have easily listened to the wise woman from REI back in 1991 and saved myself 18 years of grief.
Obviously skill ranges among individual emplyees of REI vary widely but I am still impressed by that encounter so many years ago.
She had mentioned that she had hiked the Appalachian trail… Had i known at the time what that was, i would surely have taken her words more seriously.
The ultimate irony is that now I have hiked the PCT, CDT, and AT, and family and friends tell me I should work at REI myself.
I actually would consider it but i am making 27 bucks an hour plumbing right now.
Even more irony for you… Well, getting off the "path" to follow the money.
I also feel there is the real danger of the pressure to sell heavy useless gear to hikers when what they really need is to shed mental "pounds" of limitations.
Remember.. that REI employee in 1991 told me NOT to buy that piece of REI gear!
I don't think long distance hikers are the best people to espouse gear selection to "weekend" hikers either.
Different goals and different expectations of "comfort".
I hope all this makes sense and doesn't seem assenine.
It is true there is a divide between every persons hiking style and expectations though.
This is a really tough topic to discuss without sounding pompous or something.
It was just last year when i was on the AT and I would dread people asking me about my "light" pack and gear.
What works for a long distance hiker might be unacceptably light for someone else with different objectives.
This is delicate…
But, I think a lot of folks you find at REI are more "inclined" towards the weekend backpacker.
I am being very general here so don't beat me up okay.. I think you get the idea.
But of course there is still the case of the excellant advice, from that REI employee that i did not heed in 1991, so go figure.
REI accepted those Raichle Montagna Boots, even covered in snowseal, as a return as well… Yea that takes the cake.Jun 4, 2012 at 6:57 am #1883812
@lotuseaterLocale: Colorado Foothills
I was surprised to see EN ratings when I went into REI earlier in the year. The labels were inconsistent – some showed the comfort limit; others showed the lower limit; and others showed the 'old' temperature rating as guessed by the manufacturer.
I asked one of the more experienced salespeople to explain it to me, and he fumbled his way through a vague response. I asked him why only some of the bags had EN ratings, and he told me that all suppliers of sleeping bags have till the end of this year to comply. Then came my challenge – How's that working with Big Agnes? Their top bags cannot be rated using the EN 13537 test. He mumbled something into his beard and excused himself to find a less annoying customer.Jun 4, 2012 at 7:46 am #1883825
Yeah, I can see where you could be a threat to the Boulder REI camping staff, Stuart. I have finally attained "Pest" status with Ali (the adroit store manager). A couple of times when I was in the store, and she was orienting new hires in the upstairs glass enclosed conference room, I could see her pointing me out to the group. I later learned that she was telling them, "Watch out for that one. He's a nice guy, but he can be a pest and take up a lot of your time."
I have made it my business to politely educate hew hires on lightweight backpacking techniques. Things like kitchen scales, dehydrated food/FBC, quilts, cuben & carbon fiber, and the Skurka-Clelland! philosophies. My messages don't seem to stick with them too often though.
However, there are a few fairly knowlegeable staff folks in the camping section, but you have to know who they are. With the constant turnover, that becomes difficult.Jun 4, 2012 at 8:39 am #1883838
@paulmagsLocale: People's Republic of Boulder
Not sure I want to spend so much time in outdoor stores that the staff knows me by reputation…it means i am not spending enough time outdoors. :DJun 4, 2012 at 8:41 am #1883839
@lotuseaterLocale: Colorado Foothills
Too funny, Gary. And to think, two years ago I was still walking around the store, marked up copy of the Backpacker Gear Guide in hand, believing most of what the staff were telling me. It was Smudge (?) who I schooled in EN ratings. He's been around for a few years, and I assume it's due to his supposed product knowledge – he doesn't fit the mold for salesmanship :-)Jun 4, 2012 at 9:09 am #1883852
I know just what you mean, Paul. But it's a good way to pass time on a snowy/rainy afternoon. And it's fun to spend time with the likes of Gary Neptune and George, the manager of TNF, as well as taking a slow lap through McGuckin's Hardware while I'm in the neighborhood. I've got a lot of free time.
As for Smudge, his other job is being a security guard at concerts in Mexico and the Caribbean–he's perfect for that.Jun 4, 2012 at 10:25 am #1883871
@paulmagsLocale: People's Republic of Boulder
>>>But it's a good way to pass time on a snowy/rainy afternoon.
On a clear day you can see REI from here. ;)
(Looking down into Gregory Canyon)
Being serious..dunno. Playing "Stump the Chumps" at gear stores means less time for hiking, drinking a good beer at SoSun, cooking a nice meal or reading a good book with a cup of dark roast coffee.
To bring this back around, As Matthew stated, REI serves a different purpose. I don't think the average consumer at REI really cares about the wonders of cuben. Hell, I'm a reasonably experienced backpacker and I can only get so much excitement over EN ratings and cuben fiber. :OJun 4, 2012 at 10:54 am #1883881
@socal-nomadLocale: North San Diego county
I have found some Rei staff knowledgeable you can always look at their wall with all the photos on it and it shows what each staff members expertise is in. Also their are some staff members who do the ultra light weight clinics I know one staff member is pretty cool and is into the minimalist approach of backpacking he's a Ex marine. He and his buddies go out some times with what they can carry in their pockets and the Rei Flash 18 packs for over night or a weekend trips. But he know better than to suggest it to people and he ask question to find out your skill in backpacking to get you the right equipment.
TerryJun 4, 2012 at 10:57 am #1883884
Cheers all for replying.
Seem to be the same in other oudoor stores I have shopped in latey, some staff know what they are doing and some dont have a clue.Jun 4, 2012 at 1:28 pm #1883929
Pretty mixed bag, but we're also asking for more and different information than most people are. I'd bet for most customers their level of knowledge is more than adequate.Jun 4, 2012 at 4:02 pm #1883964
…Jun 4, 2012 at 5:06 pm #1883974
Going to REI was a big treat for me as at 2 hours drive its the nearest outdoor shop to me :-)Jun 4, 2012 at 5:39 pm #1883985
@ngatelLocale: Southern California
Their business model has changed over the years since I first started going there (my membership number is 6 digits and they now have over 10 million registered members). Seems like the stores generate the majority of sales to the urbanites who want brand name clothes. And upper management used to be populated by mountaineers and climbers, but today REI is run by retail experts.
Also, the quality (knowledge) of personnel varies by location. I have been in many of their stores.
We can't be hard on the employees, it is not their fault if management doesn't train them. Also, management wants people who can sell, sell, sell; not give expert advice. But whatever the knowledge level, most of the REI staff I have encountered are very customer-oriented and friendly.
But then, can the staff at Home Depot or Lowes give you the expert advice that you can get at a locally owned and operated hardware store? In most cases, no.
Its just a sign of the times. And today, more than ever, buyers need to educate themselves when purchasing goods and services.Jun 4, 2012 at 5:41 pm #1883986
Part of it is the same reason why as you get older the average policeman/school teacher , looks younger…
that is WE change.
The more you get to know about something the less others appear to know.
Also do keep in mind that the folk that participate here represent a tiny minority of the hiking community, or more precisely of the outdoor gear buyers
BTW, it isn't at all uncommon here (in Australia) for people to go into a store , try stuff out , ask questions and then buy on line.
So a bit hard for store owners to pay top wages to guys giving free advice.
FrancoJun 4, 2012 at 6:52 pm #1884024
Thats quiet common in the Uk also Franco
In the past I have scoped out items in a shop and bought it online if there was a massive price difference but I would buy a can of gas or some other item while in the shop.
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