May 1, 2011 at 8:17 pm #1273164
Reactions?May 1, 2011 at 8:24 pm #1731814
@redmonkLocale: Greater California Ecosystem
Happy 8th "mission accomplished day".
Was there ever an Osama ?
2planes. 3towers.May 1, 2011 at 8:30 pm #1731816
@barryannarborLocale: New England
Fantastic that he's dead – that Pakistan was harboring him is disturbing – and we've paid a hideous price for this win. 47,000 of our soldiers dead or wounded, a trillion dollars.
But now that he's dead – cremate him and flush him down the toilet.May 1, 2011 at 8:33 pm #1731817
Not ready to believe it yet. Confirmation needed.May 1, 2011 at 8:40 pm #1731822
– -K.T.- –Participant
Can we make airplane travel pleasant again?May 1, 2011 at 9:01 pm #1731831
@retiredjerryLocale: Oregon and Washington
"that Pakistan was harboring him is disturbing"
News reported that Pakistan cooperated in locating Osama
I think they took part in actionMay 1, 2011 at 9:09 pm #1731833
There are still millions of Muslims worldwide that despise the United States and many that are actively pursuing our destruction.May 1, 2011 at 9:55 pm #1731849
He's dead and I'm happy about it. Why? Because I spent a year of my life getting shot at and blown up because of that piece of ****.May 1, 2011 at 11:42 pm #1731871
@cbertLocale: N. California
Long form? Or will short form do?
Like Mark Twain, I can't think of anyone I've truly wished dead, but I admit to a certain joy in reading his obituary. However much he earned this vengeance, though, a part of me remains sad for the whole self perpetuating process of violence and vengeance and othering. There is no winning this game–all gains obtained through violence are also losses.May 2, 2011 at 1:05 am #1731875
@dirk9827Locale: Pacific Northwest
In regards to the "millions of Muslims worldwide that despise the United States", what is your proposed solution to remedy this viewpoint?
Any reasonable treatment of U.S. foreign policy would reveal many reasons for international dissatisfaction. Historically, we have had our share of failings, and haven't been the most even-handed in our response to geo-political issues. Thus, it's not difficult to understand why people might be angered by U.S. policies.
Complicating the issue further is our historic and current roles in the Israeli-Arab conflict, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan; our support for certain regimes in the Arab world, and our opposition to growing Iranian influence.
I guess what I am getting at is that it will take more than words and weapons to change opinions – actions that support positive, substantive change are necessary. These come with great risk, and will require many of the actors in these affected regions change as well. Some of this is within the control of the United States, but much of it is not.
I would be curious to hear other people chime in on this.
DirkMay 2, 2011 at 3:33 am #1731889
Sort of how I feel…May 2, 2011 at 5:24 am #1731896
You know that sickening feeling in your stomach you get when you realize that you have been scammed? Yeah, that's how I feel. I'm with Doug. Where's the body and the autopsy report? How many body doubles did Saddam Hussein have?May 2, 2011 at 6:20 am #1731901
@nerdboy52Locale: "Alas, poor Yogi.I knew him well."
They claim to have done DNA tests, but the lack of a body is disturbing. Still, it would have created far more problems, politically speaking, to put the body on display or even to produce pictures of it.May 2, 2011 at 6:38 am #1731905
@harry-nLocale: Western US
>I would be curious to hear other people chime in on this.<
Having been in the region, one big effect may be getting rid of a bogeyman for Afghans in that type of society, though Afghanistan still needs rebuilding (can't let Pakistan and the Saudi's "take care" of it again).
Also gets rid of a major bogeyman for Arabs (though Saudi and many Arab countries still have problems -why can't they all just be like Dubai?) and, frankly, gets rid of a bogeyman for us too (though it doesn't really end counter-terrorism for the West either).
My 2 cents: It can give us more momentum if used wisely, so we can get our major combatant forces out of there sooner at the very least.May 2, 2011 at 8:37 am #1731935
@jamesdmarcoLocale: Finger Lakes
DNA compairisons? That would require two tests. It is nice to know what DNA you are testing. That would require Osama to have been DNA tested previously…so, just to say they tested a body before destroying it nonsense.May 2, 2011 at 8:40 am #1731937
"Can we make airplane travel pleasant again?"
+1May 2, 2011 at 9:09 am #1731948
@kat_pLocale: Pacific Coast
I am seeing a frenzy of patriotic cheer even among 15 year olds??????
This could be a great opportunity for teachers and parents to try and explain and caution our young against group euphoria; goose bumps generated by group feeling without any understanding, can lead to some of the same horrors that we think we are against or even immune to. Dehumanize a group or an individual, sprinkle some fear or other strong emotion, have someone lead us into a chant or other loud rithmical beat, and you have the potential for horror, at the hands some angry Muslims….or anyone else.
I wish we taught about this human trait to our kids, so that they could see it coming.
Edited: added "about"…May 2, 2011 at 9:17 am #1731953
@palumboLocale: Rocky Mountains
"However much he earned this vengeance, though, a part of me remains sad for the whole self perpetuating process of violence and vengeance and othering. There is no winning this game–all gains obtained through violence are also losses."
So well said. I've had trouble putting my feelings into cohesive thoughts. This is pretty close.
As Ghandi said "an eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind."May 2, 2011 at 9:18 am #1731954
@johnjLocale: Orange County, CA
They can "triangulate" from family members.May 2, 2011 at 9:19 am #1731956
@jakep_82Locale: Pacific Northwest
Do you really think Obama would announce that they killed him if he wasn't dead? That would be a massive mistake and political suicide. If a video of Bin Laden is released any time between now and the next election, it would be the end of Obama's political career. He said the body was disposed of within 24 hours according to Islamic tradition and I can't think of any sane reason not to believe that's true.May 2, 2011 at 9:29 am #1731959
@retiredjerryLocale: Oregon and Washington
Donald Trump will force Obama to release pictures and DNA test resultsMay 2, 2011 at 9:41 am #1731966
@jakep_82Locale: Pacific Northwest
At this point Trump has been completely marginalized. He's being attacked on all sides by both Democrats and Republicans. The only thing he's "campaigned" on is that Obama isn't qualified. As time goes on the media will stop paying attention to him and he'll disappear from the polls. In other words Trump won't be making Obama do anything. If they want to release pictures, they will. My guess is they won't.May 2, 2011 at 9:51 am #1731969
"In other words Trump won't be making Obama do anything."
Ummmmmmmmm, I think Jerry was kidding…..May 2, 2011 at 10:05 am #1731977
If it's a conspiracy then We have him alive , but faked his death and dumped a body where it cannot be examined while we release his DNA test. Now we begin to extract what information we can.May 2, 2011 at 10:23 am #1731991
Conspiracy buffs won’t get a debate from me. If he’s still alive then he’ll no doubt release embarrassing audio and/or video clips clearly referencing current events that happened after May 1, 2011. If he is dead, his silence will not silence conspiracy theorists.
If he is dead, is that justice? Little doubt of that. Is it for the best? Perhaps. But I have to add a big +1 to those who choose to skip the celebrations.
The evening of May 1 presented me with a striking juxtaposition. Feeling board, I re-watched a film I view every several years. When finished, I switched from DVD mode to broadcast mode to find myself right in the middle of CBS’s coverage of the Bin Laden news.
The movie is “The Scarlet and the Black” a hollywood dramatization (no doubt embellished) of the very personal and life&death struggle between a Vatican priest named Hugh O'Flaherty and Herbert Kappler, the commander of the Gestapo in Rome from the death of Mussolini until the German evacuation of Rome. Embellished or not, the well documented real story is as amazing as the film version. O'Flaherty’s underground operation successfully hid several thousand Jewish Italians and escaped allied POWs.
Kappler was arrested when the allies took control of Rome and spent the rest of his life in prison. During that time he was visited more or less monthly by O'Flaherty, who eventually baptized him into the Catholic Church in 1959.
A similar, older story can be found in Lincoln’s plan for treatment of our southern citizens at the end of U.S. Civil War. When berated for his leniency he replied “Do we not destroy our enemies, madam, when we make them our friends?”
Of course, there were those who refused to become our friends after the Civil War and there are those that will refuse now. There was and still is little viable alternative to continued use of force in those situations. But to assume that all would refuse leaves us with a problem too large for force to solve, indeed it places us at risk of creating new enemies faster than we can kill them.
There I go, getting all preachy again …
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