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SMD fusion 65


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  • This topic has 93 replies, 35 voices, and was last updated 7 years ago by Sam C.
Viewing 25 posts - 26 through 50 (of 94 total)
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  • #2100109
    Nathan Wernette
    Spectator

    @werne1nm

    Locale: Michigan

    thought the exodus was framed? or had a stay in it.

    Nathan

    #2100110
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    I'm pretty sure Gossamer Gear packs are sewn in Mexico.

    Internal frame packs, which for this discussion would include the Gorilla, Mariposa, Catalyst, Circuit, and Ohm, as well as the Fusion line, are typically a lot more complex to sew than something like the Exodus. All those small pieces in the harness and suspension add a lot of time at just about every step of production. My assumption is that the adjustable harness of the Fusion is significantly more complex to make than anything from ULA or GG. All those swoopy pockets would be as well.

    There's a lot to be said for designing a pack so that it's simple to sew. The HMG Porter certainly qualifies, and based on photos I think the Arc Blast does as well (insofar as all the suspension stuff is external). The Paradox Unaweep I posted about in another thread is a hundred dollars cheaper than the Evolution frame and bag combo of the same size and material, and that cost savings is pretty much entirely in it being simpler and faster to make (sewn in CO, btw).

    Made in the USA hunting packs by the likes of Kifaru, Stone Glacier, and Mystery Ranch are typically 400-700 dollars.

    All interesting stuff to think about.

    #2100118
    Dale Wambaugh
    BPL Member

    @dwambaugh

    Locale: Pacific Northwest

    "Made in the USA hunting packs by the likes of Kifaru, Stone Glacier, and Mystery Ranch are typically 400-700 dollars. "

    McHale comes to mind on that list as well.

    I see the offshore manufacturing as a fairly typical evolution for any growing entrepreneurial business. They start out in the garage with a vision and then need to divide time between marketing and manufacturing and the business taking on a life of its own. Going offshore can avoid huge investments in facilities and machinery, hardware and fabric, as well as labor costs. It's more like going to the store vs starting your own store.

    Imagine having a love of the outdoors and a penchant for design and wanting the independence of owning your own business. That can be quite a trap if not done carefully with a prescience of mind. Like many possessions, a small business can possess the owner.

    Some cottage builders have managed to keep a balance and hire local folk to sew them, but their operations are relatively small. I've seen several cottage manufacturers that hang up the "gone hiking" sign several times a year. Those are the folk who have drawn a line in the sand between business and recreation. It's an interesting process to me.

    #2100132
    David Ure
    Member

    @familyguy

    Mystery Ranch is now manufacturing their new Mountain Line of packs (including some of their military offerings) out of the Philippines and not the USA.

    #2100141
    David Drake
    BPL Member

    @daviddrake

    Locale: North Idaho

    Not a business person, but it sounds like Dale pretty much nails the reasons.

    Add to that, that the US doesn't have much of a garment industry anymore, so contracting with a domestic operation is prob. out. And sewing has always been a pretty poorly-paid profession–I expect finding skilled employees is difficult, and turnover high.

    I doubt smaller manufacturers like SMD see the profits from going overseas that Patagonia, Osprey, etc do. Just reduced management hassles. Further, I expect running those small companies is a full time job (at least), with financial rewards somewhat lower than the annual incomes of at least a few BPL members (e.g., those who can afford to buy multiple cuben shelters and a closet full of packs). That's not a judgment–we all make our choices. I just have a hard time picturing cottage makers as cigar-chomping plutocrats, with their zero-drop hiking shoes on the necks of the proletariat.

    I do wish there was a little more transparency about where stuff is made–Ron Moak's post was fine, but there's no indication on either tags or the gear where my Haven and net tent were manufactured. I can understand why someone would take whatever loopholes they're allowed to avoid branding their gear 'Made in China' (or wherever), but more voluntary disclosure would be nice.

    #2100162
    Valerie E
    Spectator

    @wildtowner

    Locale: Grand Canyon State

    Mark H.,

    You are a godsend!!!!

    I will anxiously await your further impressions once you receive your Bearikade and have tried packing your sleeping bag, tarp, etc. into the main compartment along with the Expedition.

    Please feel free to PM me if you don't feel like posting that info here on this thread.

    I am very grateful for your input.

    #2100168
    Nathan Wernette
    Spectator

    @werne1nm

    Locale: Michigan

    EDIT

    I was watching the ULA backpack videos provided on the ULA youtube channel (some of them are kind of ridiculous but do enjoy the "how to" torso measurement video ;) but i digress)

    I now see why they might have moved production and why they claim it to me "far more complex"

    With the ULA packs the hip belt is simply attached with velco (via the OHM 2.0 video on youtube, with simpler frame construction than what the SMD fusion pack is (at least what I imagine it is being from youtube videos and information on the web)

    It is more complex. Like another person wrote in a previous post the adjustable yoke of the pack may be far more complicated than other packs of its kind

    Regardless, this is a way different design of any pack of its weight on the market. I think its worth a try. I'm going to put in an order tonight with it and be back with pictures and an initial review of the pack.

    #2100624
    Mark Haffner
    BPL Member

    @markhaffner

    Locale: PNW

    The bearikade fits vertically. With the canister pushed all the way to the side my FF Hummingbird UL 20 long bag stuffs to about 2-3 inches below the top of the bearikade (10.5" high) With 3 rolls on the top of the bag there is about 15" from the top of the canister to the top of the pack. With the bearikade pushed all the way down there is a little room under (loose in the center) that you could fill with something small. Filling up the rest of the pack and walking around the house I didn't feel the bearikade as the center is still behind the yoke. Actually fits pretty well.

    Comparing the Fusion to some of the other packs mentioned on this thread I don't think is comparing apples to apples. The Fusions suspension is definitely more complex. It is fully adjustable in height between the hip belt and the shoulder yoke. The hip belt is substantial and being able to adjust the angle that the belt rests on your hips makes it very comfortable. All this complexity isn't for everyone, but at my age I want to carry my 25 lbs (11 lb BPW) on my hips, not my shoulders.

    My car is made in the US by a German company. My bike is made in Italy. Most of my clothes are made in Japan or china. My favorite new pack is made by a US company somewhere other than in the US. The world is shrinking!

    #2100635
    Valerie E
    Spectator

    @wildtowner

    Locale: Grand Canyon State

    THANK YOU, Mark!!!! This is exactly what I needed to know. As my Southern husband would say, "bless your heart"! :^)

    The Fusion actually sounds like it might work for me, and with my odd proportions, I really need that adjustment system for proper fit. I might find it a little small-ish with a bear canister, but maybe I could sew myself an extra top lid out of cuben for ten or so extra liters.

    And +1 for carrying the weight on the hips!

    #2100678
    Shane L
    Spectator

    @shanegasm

    Locale: Nebraska

    I'm hoping someone will post a review with a comparison between the ULA Circuit and the Fusion. I'm very interested in how they differ in load carrying, especially the hipbelts and frames.

    #2100769
    Chris Martin
    Member

    @hope_for_gorilla

    Locale: Finger Lakes

    I'm thru hiking the PCT with a Fusion 50! Hiked the first 152 miles with my trusty ULA Circuit, then went back for ADZPCTKO. Met Brian Frankle. He encouraged me to load up my gear in one of the new packs and go for a hike. I was sold more or less immediately.

    I'm now in Wrightwood with 200 miles on the new pack. Don't have time to post a full review (that will come in a few months), but in brief:

    The pack carries like a dream. It does feel like I am wearing the pack, as opposed to carrying it. (I'm 5' 8" with a 28" waist, longish torso, and bony hips. My base weight is 12-14 pounds. For me, the pack volume maxes out with 5ish days of food and 4-5 liters of water. Still transfers weight effectively with a 35+ pound load.

    The harness is a huge improvement over the Circuit. For example, The tension-bearing parts of the hipbelt sit above and below my hipbones, not directly on them (like with the Circuit). This is much more comfortable for me. I lock down the hipbelt and don't need to adjust it for hours, whereas I was frequently messing with the Circuit's hipbelt, never quite satisfied with it.

    The pack makes solid contact with my lumbar region and spine as designed, not my entire back. No issues with sweating/chafe.

    The shoulder straps are on par with the Circuit's, maybe a bit wider. They are set a little bit too far apart for me, but I am a small person. Also, the shoulder yoke allows for more articulation. I have greater freedom to twist my torso around than with the Circuit.

    The exterior sleeping pad straps (below the shovel pocket) are great. They hold my Z-Lite torso pad and GG 1/8" pad. With a pad attached, the pack stands upright when you set it down. Awesome!

    The Fusion 50's shovel pocket is much smaller than the Circuit's, though capacious enough for me. The Fusion has no shock cord net, but there are still several places to secure damp laundry.

    My only complaint is with the little side pockets, made of stretchy and questionably durable fabric (though no tears yet). They are designed to fit 1L Smartwater bottles, with the bottle neck held in place with the compression strap above. Getting the bottles in and out with the pack on is possible but somewhat awkward for me, and I'm pretty flexible. I do miss the Circuit's cavernous, super durable side pockets. I would stick my Jetboil pot in there and eat breakfast as I hike. Can't do that with the Fusion.

    Regarding capacity: Brian said that the Fusion 50 is a bit smaller than the Circuit, and the 65 is a bit bigger. I would have a lot of difficulty getting enough food in my 50 for the entire Sierra Nevada (and I haven't even tried it with a bear canister yet). So, I'll probably resupply in Independence via Kearsarge Pass. If I wanted to hike the entire Sierra section continuously, I'd need the extra capacity of the Fusion 65.

    #2100773
    Nathan Wernette
    Spectator

    @werne1nm

    Locale: Michigan

    exactly the input i'm looking for thank you so much and good luck on the rest of the trail!

    #2100840
    Valerie E
    Spectator

    @wildtowner

    Locale: Grand Canyon State

    Mille mercis, Chris Martin!!!! Hope you're having a great time out there in the desert…and you have told me all the stuff I wanted to know (and then some) about the Fusion.

    Too bad about your breakup with Gwyneth, but the PCT will heal all wounds, LOL. (I'm sorry, I just couldn't resist the bad joke!)

    #2100861
    Michael Hill
    BPL Member

    @mh

    Thanks, Chris. That's very helpful.

    FWIW, this photograph shows what the side pockets are like:

    http://www.pcta.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/IMG_1618.jpg

    (That's from the following page:)
    http://www.pcta.org/2014/ultra-high-tech-mapping-pct-long-distance-geo-logger-19469/

    #2101024
    Derek M.
    BPL Member

    @dmusashe

    Locale: Southern California

    Again, just a reminder that I've only demoed this pack in the store, but my quick impression of the water bottle pockets sort of echos Chris's sentiments…

    They seemed really awkward to use and not big enough. It was nearly impossible for me to slip a water bottle in and out of the pocket while the pack was on my back. It was certainly hard enough that I would never bother to do it while backpacking for real. I'd either have another person grab my water bottle, or take the pack on and off each time.

    Non user-friendly water bottle pockets are such a basic flaw in a pack that it just astounds me that they still exist. After all, water bottles are probably the single most needed item in terms of routine access during the day. Why pack makers can't get this right is just beyond me. It's not a trivial issue.

    Really, the very poor water bottle pockets were the only thing that I didn't like about this pack, but this is kind of big deal to me so I'm holding off on purchasing one of these packs until this issue is fixed or I find a workaround that hasn't occurred to me yet.

    #2101041
    Nathan Wernette
    Spectator

    @werne1nm

    Locale: Michigan

    Your work around could be a hydration tube?

    #2101044
    Woubeir (from Europe)
    BPL Member

    @woubeir

    "Made in the USA hunting packs by the likes of Kifaru, Stone Glacier, and Mystery Ranch are typically 400-700 dollars."

    Elemental Horizons comes to my mind with e.g. for the (framed) Kailas 230 $ .

    #2101649
    Nathan Wernette
    Spectator

    @werne1nm

    Locale: Michigan

    I got it in the mail today.

    anyone want to see a video? i'll throw one up tonight.

    any pictures can be taken as well and questions about it can be answered.

    Hopefully get out the end of the month and use it!

    #2101656
    Valerie E
    Spectator

    @wildtowner

    Locale: Grand Canyon State

    Yes, please — any photos, video, and comments will be greatly appreciated by ME! :^)

    #2101675
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    Read ALL the words.

    #2101678
    Woubeir (from Europe)
    BPL Member

    @woubeir

    I guess you mean the word 'hunting' ? I saw that before posting. But did I missed the point where specifically hunting packs were asked ?

    #2101685
    David Chenault
    BPL Member

    @davec

    Locale: Queen City, MT

    My point was that all the US made cottage packs have fixed shoulder straps, which relatively speaking are simple and cheap to build. The only US made packs I can think of which have adjustable harnesses (ie comparable to the Fusion in this dimension) are hunting packs, which one assumes explains the choice to off-shore production of the Fusion.

    SMD could either off-shore it and keep cost comparable to ULA, Gossamer, etc and within touching distance of Osprey; do it on shore and hope the flash factor and US made cred sold it; or clean up the design and sew it in the US, thus sacrificing some of the aesthetic appeal. Choice 1 is quite understandable.

    #2101691
    Woubeir (from Europe)
    BPL Member

    @woubeir

    oh, wright, that way. Then, indeed, you may assume I said nothing.

    #2101833
    Nathan Wernette
    Spectator

    @werne1nm

    Locale: Michigan

    Hey so here is my initial reactions to the fusion, this post is mainly for Valerie and addressing some of the things in this thread.

    I have messed around with it all night since i got it and think i have a pretty good handle on how it adjusts and works. I put our 20 pound safe in the pack and walked around with it and it was good. My wife can also wear this pack, albeit the hip belt is way to big for her but she can get the fit sort of ok (with no weight) and adjustments to her liking.

    for reference I am 5 10, stocky and 230 pounds size 38 pant, my wife is 5 1 and 100 pounds and probably a size 0-2.

    I'll break it down into categories for better organization.

    Yoke: This pack is fully adjustable. It does have a small medium and large markings on the pack but you can adjust the yoke up and down in the various slots to fine tune your torso length. I have mine in the large slot with about only three inches of yoke in the slot. I'm consider myself a medium torso but had it maxed out in my opinion. Maybe i'm not, maybe i've measured my torso wrong. I'm pretty open to any variety of pack and have chosen and gotten good fit results from medium fixed frame packs but for some reason I have the fusion on the max adjustment. My wife got good results at the medium torso slot.

    Shoulder straps: I consider myself a pretty big dude. I am a little overweight but do not consider myself fat. I had the should straps maxed out as well, They came down to about nipple level for me. They fit, but to me they were too short. My wife also had the pack on and she could use the same yoke as me and was fine. They do offer the smaller yoke but I would advise just to get the regular one, measure your current backpack straps and then decide on a shoulder strap size. The regular straps for the fusion are 18in and the small are 15.
    Also the shoulder pockets….very useless. To small. I could put my iPhone in one pocket with about enough room to stuff an expo marker in with it (for reference). I was also able to stuff my apple magic mouse into the other with no room for anything else.. They sit to high on my shoulder to be of any use.
    another thing about the sternum strap. It has places to adjust the strap up and down but i can't get the nylon strap out of the plastic adjustment thingy (the correct term) I don't see anyway i can adjust the sternum strap w/o taking out the end seam to make enough room. The nylon webbing is too thick to be taken out. Its really annoying…

    Main compartment: The main compartment is not as big as you think. When you think 65 liters you think huge. well when they factor in the 65L they also factor in the extended collar, pockets (on the hip belt as well, they add 1 liter per to the total) and the huge shovel pocket on the back. Its smaller. But thats not a big problem. Everything that my wife and I carry will and should fit in the pack. You can access the frame sheet and aluminum stay from inside the pack. I'm not sure what they call the "interior zippered stash pocket" inside the main compartment… OR the "interior security pocket" I see none…. Now there is a zippered compartment inside the main compartment but it gives you access to the frame sheet and aluminum stay, BOTH can be removed for customization of the bend in the stay BUT the pack cannot be run frameless totally. You can remove the aluminum stay but not the frame sheet. The yoke attaches to the frame sheet… Anyway I digress, the main compartment isn't anything special (most aren't) its a big stuff sack. The zippered access to the frame sheet has a divide in it which i am guessing is the "stash pocket"…eh… its really not…i'll get a pic up tomorrow.

    Hip Belt: As noted in all the previous posts about the fusion, the hip belt is pretty nice and comfortable. I was impressed with how you can fine tune the compression of the hip belt onto your hips. This is done by the articulation of the hip belt. It is hard to explain but it works very well. Pockets on the hip belt were big and useful. they are seriously really big. I could stuff two houdini's into one hip belt. overall the hip belt is awesome.

    Side pockets: this is a shortcoming i think someone else mentioned on this thread as well. They are shorter than the circuits pockets and have four way stretchy material to them. I had the pack stuffed full of towels and pillows and was unable to fit my smart water bottles (two empty ones) in the side pockets very well. They are just too short. One person mentioned about using the compression strap to help hold them in, i'm not a fan of that either, compression straps to me should be pulled pretty tight. In my opinion i would want my water bottle to not be under my compression straps. These pockets remind me of my Granite Gear Vapor Trail side pockets. I'm sure i could fit a full platypus soft bottle in each side of the fusion, but. not totally won over by the side pockets.

    rear shovel pocket. HUGE. you can stuff a lot of w/e you want to in there. there are gussets or pleats in each side of the pocket to let it expand even more. The top compression strap is attached to the top of this pocket. It keeps anything you stuff in there secure.

    Roll top closure. Just like any other roll top. its fine, works like advertised.

    Sleeping pad straps. Great if you have a CCF pad, useless if you don't. I guess you could roll up a wet fly to a tent and put it there temporarily but otherwise the straps offer nothing for me. They aren't compression straps…they do nothing to really compress anything

    It handled the weight very well. I stuffed a 20 pound safe into the pack and it was good to go. The spine of the pack sits in front of the hip belt so when you really adjust your hip belt properly it transfers the weight onto your hips very very well. The ideal pack will transfer most of the weight onto your hips with the shoulder straps just really kind of chilling and keeping the weight from falling back off your body right? if that made any sense to you, this pack does that. very well. very comfortably.

    Overall I like the pack, but do I love it….No. For the shortcomings mentioned above and in previous posts I think at least for my initial impressions (and the 30 day return policy of SMD) I am going to return the pack.

    This pack offers a lot. A fully adjustable LIGHTWEIGHT pack is awesome, if you need it. I do not.

    The adjustable torso reminds me a lot of the Deuter ACT lite pack.

    All the spine is really is a cut down frame sheet with a single aluminum stay.

    The shoulder straps are too short for me

    The sternum strap can be adjusted but the nylon webbing is too thick to pass through the plastic slip lock thingy (correct term)

    The side pockets are too short.

    Sleeping pad straps are useless for me (my opinion, i do not use a CCF pad)

    Again, these are my initial impressions of the pack, I'll fiddle around with it again tomorrow and what not, I can post some pictures if you want. maybe a video if you want to see exactly what i am talking about.

    Let me know if you have any questions or didn't understand what I was trying to say. Thanks!

    Pic of sternum strap
    Pic of zipper access inside the pack

    #2101872
    Shane L
    Spectator

    @shanegasm

    Locale: Nebraska

    Thanks so much, that's just the kind of information I was looking for. Just one thing: do you have any experience with the ULA Circuit? I'm trying to choose between the Fusion and the Circuit, and would love any insight comparing the two. (Your comment about the straps worries me, as one of the things about the Circuit that I like are the S-shaped straps, but I would sacrifice those if the weight transfer of the Fusion was appreciably better)

    Thanks again!

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