Oct 9, 2013 at 3:35 pm #1308537
@wildtownerLocale: Grand Canyon State
21 Citations at Grand Canyon National Park for entering during Gov't ShutdownOct 9, 2013 at 4:11 pm #2032456
@hknewmanLocale: Western US
Grand Canyon rangers do not kid around when it's ticket time and (for repeat offenders prior to the shutdown) even jail. Good way to lose money and a day of work spent at the federal courthouse.
Then again it did not even make the Phoenix newspaper as of now, since issuing tickets is common up there.
Ed/Add:Oct 9, 2013 at 9:03 pm #2032552
Defiance…Civil Disobedience.Oct 9, 2013 at 9:32 pm #2032563
………."In their Wednesday meeting, the commissioners said they were prepared to provide or clean toilets, collect garbage, conduct search and rescue operations, staff park entrances and provide law enforcement…………….They agreed that they would explain their actions by saying "we as a county are trying to do what is in the best interests of the public."……. ….
And why not? If they can manage it, good for them.Oct 9, 2013 at 10:42 pm #2032575
If they can't , we lose a national park, because a local group thought it could be run on a county park budget and staff.Oct 10, 2013 at 5:57 am #2032611
Why would we lose a national park if the county tried to keep it open during the shutdown?Oct 10, 2013 at 10:21 am #2032725
@jenmitolLocale: In my dreams....
I still find it quite ironic that those who advocate for small government then turn around all upset about things they can't access in the government. Yep, the federal government does a lot of good things. It sucks when you take all the money away……..Oct 10, 2013 at 10:34 am #2032734
Is it hard to imagine that we only have national parks because the states couldn't be trusted not to develop every piece of land that can turn a profit ?
I don't find it a stretch that a local county could find that it is in the best interest of their immediate public to keep the park open, and then decide that the way to pay for it is to start leasing thhe land and bringing in more for profit development.
Take control of our shared national resources away from the feds, and allow them to be placed under the control of local county authorities, and I believe we will lose them to local best interests.Oct 10, 2013 at 10:57 am #2032749
I not sure all the money has been taken away.
How come when governments, local, state or federal run into financial problems the first they they want to deny are taxpayer facing services. We can't fill your potholes, cut the grass at the WW II memorial, keep parks open, pick up the garbage, blah blah blah.
Can you image a business pulling back on it's Customers? Sorry we're a little short on funds this month, call back in December.
Heck, why not fire the assistant, to the assistant director to the associate regional supervisor to the senior director of spin control. Or maybe not mail billions of dollars of checks to dead people.
This country's debt is over $16,000,000,000,000.00. Our GDP is $11,000,000,000,000, the federal budget alone is +20% of GDP. WTF, anyone run their household like this?
Oh I now it just bits and bytes.
I don't care which ideology, party affiliation, left handed, right handed or sexual orientation you are, how can anyone argue the government's not big enough.
Oh yeah, tax the rich those lucky bastards. The rich don't pay taxes, that's why we have a 30,000 page tax code. They flee the high tax countries to find a safe haven for their money, just ask the French.
Does anybody really think Obama will "negotiate" on a small budget, please!Oct 10, 2013 at 11:22 am #2032768
Does anybody really think Obama will "negotiate" on a small budget, please!
You mean like the continuing of sequestration level spending ?
It isn't about negotiation. One side is too dumb to see they already won the fiscal fight.
The president is black and so they will claim the need to "negotiate" until that changes.Oct 10, 2013 at 12:50 pm #2032804
@jenmitolLocale: In my dreams....
First of all Ken, a huge national economy is not a business, nor it is a household. The economics do not even remotely operate the same, and to think that they do is oversimplification at best.
In a national economy, my spending is your income, and your spending is my income. To make an economy run, and grow, does not require balanced budgets (even Reagan preached the benefits of deficit spending), nor does it involve the same ledger sheets you use to pay your mortgage. America is not a for-profit corporation, or a family…it is an economy. Totally different animal.
The shutdown happened because Congress did not appropriate funds. So no, as of the new fiscal year there is no more money. So those workers are working without pay – thank them very much, because they take a lot of crap, and yet they show up every day to do thankless jobs, in service to you, even as you deride all the government workers and government spending out there.
A vote to authorize the debt ceiling does not mean the US buys more stuff with debt – it is to authorize payments of debts already Incurred. And no, there is no legal, viable alternative to default. Which any business, or family, knows is an economic disaster. Now magnify that to the international economy and we're all screwed if the GOP doesn't get its head out of its backside and pass a clean continuing resolution then raise the debt ceiling.Oct 10, 2013 at 12:54 pm #2032805
Here's something I found quite interesting. Heard a report today that the Chamber of Commerce is going to actively support candidates who run against Tea Party candidates. Imagine, business no longer all that friendly to parts of the Republican Party (and parts of the Republican Party not all that taken with business).
Perhaps there really is something to all that second coming stuff…..Oct 10, 2013 at 1:42 pm #2032828
I find it all interesting, if worrisome…
Sides are shifting making it all the more obvious how both parties have been up for grabs by interests.
As far as the debt ceiling…@Jennifer….what do you think about Obama's comments and views on the debt ceiling in 2006?Oct 10, 2013 at 1:53 pm #2032835
"As far as the debt ceiling…@Jennifer….what do you think about Obama's comments and views on the debt ceiling in 2006?"Oct 10, 2013 at 2:10 pm #2032840
Interesting graphic. I somehow thought China would have a larger share.Oct 10, 2013 at 2:26 pm #2032849
Really, that is all I am wondering about.
Not so much from Obama and his change of heart on a number of issues, from world policing to marijuana to transparency in government, because once you are the President you become part of the lies and the interests and the established patterns that come with that. What I would like is consistency from people like us and right now I am looking for it from the left, because I don't see the outrage that should be there no matter who is in the White House.
If the NSA scandal ( because to me it is a scandal) had happened under a republican President, the left would be up in arms, and rightly so!
Syria, Libia,Iran …same thing; protests would abound, and rightly so!
Drones….protests would about and rightly so!
Handing over raw, unfiltered communications data of US citizens to Israel……
No, it isn't politicians that are the most guilty, it's us that say nothing when the one we voted for crosses the line. We justify all this because " it's better than the other Party". That logic has hurt us. As one who was happy that Obama was elected, I find it a no brainer to point out where he has failed.
The Right does not like him, duh; the left still needs to speak up.
Here is someone on the left that has the fortitude to stand up to the lies.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeff-cohen/how-do-you-know-when-pres_b_3558857.htmlOct 10, 2013 at 2:53 pm #2032860
This administration has never, never passed a budget. The congress has been forced to pass with a gun to their head, blackmailed, subject to extortion a continuing resolution to fund the government.
You might recall that the Republicans won a near record level of House seats in 2010 along with a high number of state governorships and legislative seats.
The process of government requires the Executive branch submit a budget, the House passes a budget, the Senate passes a budget and they go to committee for reconciliation. Then on to the President for signature or veto.
The House has done their job, Reid has never finished his job?
So what other options does the House have to get it's views expressed in the budget.
BTW Gross Bob, your he is black argument is juvenile.Oct 10, 2013 at 2:59 pm #2032862
"BTW Gross Bob, your he is black argument in juvenile."
Just the race card, again. (double facepalm)
MattOct 10, 2013 at 5:58 pm #2032923Oct 10, 2013 at 7:01 pm #2032951
@davidadairLocale: West Dakota
Welcome to Hope and Change.Oct 10, 2013 at 10:37 pm #2033011
just Justin WhitsonMember
As long as we stay stuck in and over identify with the binary mind set of Democrats vs Republicans, or liberals vs conservatives, and all that manipulated, chess game, acting non sense, we won't ever fully wake up and see the real issues.Oct 10, 2013 at 10:43 pm #2033015
Well spoken, Justin.
MattOct 10, 2013 at 10:59 pm #2033021
@retiredjerryLocale: Oregon and Washington
#1 issue is we have the best government money can buy
maybe we can agree to make giving money to politicians illegal. Or buy TV ads. or…Oct 10, 2013 at 11:04 pm #2033025
just Justin WhitsonMember
Thank you Matt.
True enough Jerry.
How can we expect to fix this? Can we really vote our way out of it? Can we protest our way out of it? Can we just hope the younger generation will be more idealistic and less materialistic?
Do we just keep bending over?
I don't have a solution, and even armed rebellion would be mighty tough against the kind of technology and weaponry that those in power have access too, not too mention you and i are being "tapped" as we speak so it would be hard to make well organized plans in secret–not too mention there are not enough of us willing to die or worse be tortured for a true change.
So where does that leave us? Creative Forces help us.Oct 11, 2013 at 7:01 am #2033066
@retiredjerryLocale: Oregon and Washington
https://movetoamend.org/ advocates making a constitutional ammendment "that money is not speech, and that human beings, not corporations, are persons entitled to constitutional rights"
The "Occupy" movement talks about undue political enfluence
both of these are somewhat dormant
maybe we're waiting for people to become more angry about this and some organization will catch fire and be able to do something
It seems like in lieu of the Supreme Court decisions (another one is in process) we need a constitutional ammendment
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