western mountaineering down pants?

[Kevin Burton]

I'm thinking about getting a pair of these:

http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Down-Garments&cat=Pants

I tend to run cold at night and it would also allow me to wake up at 4-5AM and start breaking camp when it's nice and cold!

I compared them to the Montbel pants and these look the best. They're 850 vs 800 for the Montbel and they're slightly lighter too.

Thoughts?

[Ken Thompson]

WM does not mention a fly. The Montbell ones do have a fly. I have the Montbell ones and like them. There are some other choices out there too.

[Max Dilthey]

I find that insulated clothing and a lighter sleeping bag gives me more utility in the backcountry. It's the system I used all winter. Those pants are a work of art, but I doubt you'll find as much use outside your sleeping bag as you would with a down coat, so keep that in mind.

[Franco Darioli]

I have those WM Flash pants and like them a lot.
No, they do not have a fly , I like that too because I wear them inside the sleeping bag so I prefer not to have a zip there.
In the seat area they have a heavier nylon cover unlike shown in the photos on the website.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Yep, that's a good solution and one I use with my 25 F. overstuffed WM Megalite for temps down to 10 F.

[Mike M]

I was looking at both the WM and MB ones and instead opted for custom ones from Ben at goosefeet- it actually came out a little cheaper and I was able to customize the materials, the amount of fill (uses 850+) and they are custom sized as well

I'd check them out before pulling the pin

[Rick M]

del

[Rusty Beaver]

I was in the same boat: MB or WM. I went with WM. It's been a few yrs but it seems I did for the reasons you mentioned. I use them for what you mention too…and they are really nice. However, I made the mistake of getting mediums instead of a large…and they look and feel ridiculous on me. If only I were lucky enough to find someone with a large who wanted a medium……..

[Chad “Stick” Poindexter]

+1 of the GooseFeet Gear down pants!

A while back I was torn between the MB & the WM (Flash) down pants), but I ended up going with the GFG down pants. What I got out of it was a pair of pants that was custom fit, and with my choice of materials. They also have 3.5 oz of down (which is 1.5 oz more than either the WM or the MB-they only have 2 oz), and at only 6.2 oz, lighter than the other options too! As well, I paid $160 for them, which is the same price (or actually lower) as either of the other pairs.

Now, these are with 10D inner/outer shell materials, so they are not as robust as the seat of the WM pants, however, I wear these to sleep in, so I don't need anything super robust. While wearing them around camp, I will just wear my DriDucks rain pants over them to help protect them.

Anyway, I highly recommend them. Here is a write up I did on them a while back:

GooseFeet Gear Custom Down Pants

Also, I disagree with Max about down pants being useless outside of the tent. Having these for standing around camp are a delight, and just as useful (for me) as using them with my sleeping gear. The same goes for my down parka. I never pull out my down parka (MB UL Down Inner) until I get to camp. I don't actually hike in any of my down items, save my BRG down hat, on occasion.

For those of us that don't actually need extra layers on our lower half to hike in, down pants are a great alternative to long underwear. They provide more warmth, and come at a lighter weight penalty. Of course though, this is just my opinion, based on my own personal experience for my neck of the woods… YMMV though…

[Christopher Yi]

"I have those WM Flash pants and like them a lot.
No, they do not have a fly , I like that too because I wear them inside the sleeping bag so I prefer not to have a zip there.
In the seat area they have a heavier nylon cover unlike shown in the photos on the website."

How durable would you say the seat is?

[Franco Darioli]

Keep in mind that I only use them at camp and most of the time I will have my rain pants on top of them.
These have about 20 nights of use, maybe a few more.

BTW, in the above photo I have my jeans on under them…

[Kevin Burton]

Why do you guys find that you don't wear them while hiking?

My strategy was going to be to use them to get more hours on the trail. Basically wake up at 5AMish instead of 6AMish when its hella cold and start packing up and cooking while I have my down clothes on.

Though I suspect I might be able to shed the down pants once I leave camp.

[Chad “Stick” Poindexter]

Kevin, as I mentioned, I wear mine while at camp and of course while sleeping. This does include when doing camp chores both at night and in the morning. However, when I start packing up, they are the second thing I pack…right after my quilt. I don't hike in mine simply because my lower half is not as bothered by the cold as my upper half, and even if so, once I start hiking they warm up anyway.

[Franco Darioli]

"Why do you guys find that you don't wear them while hiking?"

If you are warm enough in your clothes at camp you will be far too warm and sweat when you start walking.
The commonest "mistake" I see on the trail is people arriving at camp and start peeling off several wet (from sweat) layers.
The same people will be cold later on in the evening…
Mind you the lowest temp I walk in is around 20f, still the principle applies at -40 too.
If you are warm with what you have on at camp at-40 you will be too hot when you start walking.

[Christopher Yi]

Thanks Franco.

+1 Chad. Been meaning to pick up a pair of down pants as my shorts/wind pants don't cut it for camp chores in the evening/morning. It'd also allow me to get away with a lighter sleeping bag.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Thanks for the photo of teh butt area of teh pants. Nice to have heavier material there, for wear and tear and fart filtering.

I'm going to order a pair of these. Thay'll go great with my down jacket and overfilled WM Megalite bag for warmth near +10 F. (-5 C??)

[Stephen M]

Hi Eric,

10f is about -12c, for those temps you might be better off with the flight pants, I have a pair and they are really worth it.

[Franco Darioli]

At 10f or so I would switch from the Summerlight/Flash kit to an Ultralite/Flight (pants and jacket) kit.
both for warmth and a bit more built in durability (that is safety net…)

[Steve H]

how low profile are the zipper on these? I'm a side-sleeper and I'd rather not have a zipper digging into my hip if possible. Do you notice the zipper, or is it small and padded enough to not notice?

[Author]

Posts