Gear: What breaks when and why?

[Daryl and Daryl]

Ed,

Thanks. You made me laugh.

Reassembling the stove wasn't hard but I had to use surgical instruments to reassemble the canister.

Daryl

[Roger Caffin]

Hi Christine

> Especially shoes that have to be replaced every 4-6 weeks
That may be a little too harsh. I take a fairly new pair of New Balance joggers to Europe each time, and they alsways last the full 2 months, with some km left at the end.

Cheers

[Brian Lewis]

"I take a fairly new pair of New Balance joggers to Europe each time, and they alsways last the full 2 months, with some km left at the end."

I suggest that the better metric might be miles walked rather than time worn. My household slippers are going strong after several years of use! :-)

Seriously, it's also about the "when to replace" algorithm. My experience is that younger and/or more thrifty thru-hikers tend to err more on the side of "wear them until they're really falling apart". I had foot surgery after the PCT, so am now even more inclined to replace my shoes after 500 – 600 miles of use. In normal life, I have no idea how many miles I have on my footwear, but for long trips it's an easy calculation.

[Roger Caffin]

Hi Brian

> My experience is that younger and/or more thrifty thru-hikers tend to err more on the
> side of "wear them until they're really falling apart".
I like the 'younger' bit – yes please! :-)
I admit the 'more thrifty' bit.
But reality is that finding replacement joggers of a 4E width in Europe is next to impossible. Trust me, I have searched.
So I make sure I take reasonably robust-looking joggers.

Cheers

[ed hyatt]

Another subjective thing……mine last the 4-6 weeks as suggested by German Hiker; that's if I am lucky. I always go through the inner heel liner really quickly.

This is an expensive pain with seemingly no solution. The only shoes that did not do this with me were Montrail Hardrocks (the 'originals' bought in the US) and Vasque Velocity's (the sole unit wore really quickly instead).

[Martin RJ Carpenter]

Footwear surely distance/terrain mediated rather than purely time? Just had to retire a pair of rockridges after maybe 300 miles because I'd totally destroyed the EVA. But quite a lot of roads in that. Sole units a little bit battered, uppers basically untouched.

Thats annoying of course! I do wish someone would do something resolable with a thinnish PU midsole. Tough uppers needn't be heavy – my Walsh extremes look terribly tough and they're not heavy at all.
(with the Ecco shoes I walk to/from work with (~4 miles/day on pavement) its the sole unit which finally goes and then it has to actually wear through to kill them. No eva involved I think.).

[Inaki Diaz de Etura]

my experience goes to at least 8 weeks of everyday, 10-12 hr/day use and that was with some Innov8 shoes that were lighter than what I usually use. Vasques and Salomons I usually wear 12+ weeks or more. I thru-hiked the PCT in just two pairs of Vasque Velocity shoes (and discarded the first one when it was still usable). I certainly use the shoes until they're literally falling apart and never had a problem with my feet/joints/whatever.

I understand this is a very personal thing, just wanted to state my case.

[German Tourist]

I think there are three aspects that determine the life expectancy of a shoe: Mileage, weight of the hiker and terrain.

The most important one is definitely the mileage a shoe is used. For me and Keen shoes it is about 1.500 km max. For me and Merrell shoes it is only around 1.200 km, so I guess there really is some technological difference in the make of the sole. After that the foam in the sole is so compounded that me feet hurt, but I guess other hikers might have a higher tolerance. Mileage effects the cushioning of the sole and the inner liner (I have the same problem as Ed Hyatt there, also it does not give me a lot of foot pain).

Another factor determining the life of the cushioning is the weight of the hiker. As the material of the cushioning is always the same no matter what shoe size I think it will take a heavier hiker less time to compound it than a lighter person.

And then of course there is the terrain but this mostly affects the abrasion of the sole. After hiking 1.200 km on easy terrain in Germany the soles of my shoes looked almost like new, whereas 600 km on the rugged Arizona Trail almost destroyed the sole.

[Brian Lewis]

Roger said:

"But reality is that finding replacement joggers of a 4E width in Europe is next to impossible. Trust me, I have searched.
So I make sure I take reasonably robust-looking joggers."

The longest I've hiked in Europe at a stretch was just a few hundred miles, so — rats! The U.S. approach of mailing something ahead to yourself doesn't work?? I.e., I would have thought in terms of flying over with one or more spare sets of shoes and mailing them ahead or at worst, finding some other way (?) to essentially cache them at or near points along the route. Because I certainly hear you on the 4E thing, it's hard enough to find shoes that work for me here.

Not something I need to know about anytime soon, but hopefully someday — ! My wife and I hope to do the Camino together sometime, but I'm sure one pair should be fine for that.

Christine mentioned weight as a factor; true, but of course after a few hundred miles, most people are looking pretty lean, and generally have discarded most extraneous stuff they don't need. Trail quality certainly is a factor, a couple of times I've been more eager to replace my shoes, but ultimately for me at least, it's about the remaining cushioning — you can get by just fine in shoes that look pretty raggedy.

Feet are so danged complicated; every long trip I seem to get some new foot problem to deal with.

[Martin RJ Carpenter]

Surely how hard the terrain is also considerably effects how compacted the foam gets?

Stuff like roads/hard packed tracks etc kills it pretty quickly, but walking on natural terrain it'll last much longer. Sadly its roads when you need it :(

Walking style too maybe. I'm certainly not heavy but my feet are relatively small for my height and I am normally going quite fast so they must get quite a bit of force.

Doesn't stop me wandering if EVA isn't mostly getting carried over from running shoes whilst walking can do with a bit less/firmer stuff that doesn't compress. Or is there some other reason that its so ubiquitous now?

It certainly seems to be a (the?) major limiting factor in terms of shoe durability.
(the non eva everyday shoes I use can manage 1000+ miles on tarmac before they start dying, and no problems with stuff hurting etc. If they resoled they'd keep going well beyond that until the uppers died.).

[Connie Dodson]

I haven't seen mention of 303 Aerospace Protectant.

I used it first on my lifejacket. Looks new. That has been impressive.

I use it on my backpack, my shoes, and any fabric gear I want to keep looking good, avoiding destruction by UV.

I never thought to use it on my shelter. I take my shelter down in daytime, like you.

I gave up on tent floors long ago. First, I went to tent fly and footprint. Next, Outdoor Research Bug Bivy. Recently, to TiGoat Bug Net Bivy and Oware AsymTarp 1.

I use zipper lube or zipper lubricant on zippers. I also pull away about 45-degrees: zipper seem to like that. But check it out: zipper lube or zipper lubricant.

There are many brands available, because zippers often wear out first.

I have had the most expensive top name brand GoreTex. I rely on DWR instead.

What is so great about DWR is that Nikwax and McNett have DWR retreatment that works.

That said, my best most long-lasting perfect mountaineering jacket was British Ventile (pale green-grey with a more grey-green liner) purchased ages ago at REI. I got 15 years hard service when only the sewn-down-tight edges frayed, finally.

By the way, this experience was in the Pacific Northwest world of rain.

I have since seen this jacket with leather binding at the edges: pricey stuff.

I think if I purchased another British Ventile it would be an anorak with cord inside the hem and cuffs for a rounded edge, not a sharp edge.

I really love this subject: function and durability and reasonably lightweight.

Thank you, German Tourist for this thread.

[John S.]

The 303 Protectant may not be intended for outdoor fabrics, according to their website. Instead they recommend the fabric guard.

[Connie Dodson]

I will check out that product.

I have used 303 Aerospace Protectorant for decades. What would I know?

303 Aerospace Protectorant was recommended by West Marine hardware for lifejackets, specifically. It had photos on the hang tag. Lifejackets have pack cloth and cordura, among other things.

I have used it on my all my Therma-A-Rests, including my Prolite 4 sleeping pad.

I hadn't used 303 Aerospace Protectorant on anything too high tech, or, the newest fabrics. I wonder if this one would work on those. I will see if I can read the fine print. I would read the fine print, or, send a query about dyneema, etc.

I did notice 303 Aerospace Protectorant made all the stitching last. I have no problem with the stitching thread and UV. I see that has been a problem for German Tourist.

I have also had no color fading.

In addition, the straps remain supple: no hard and stiff pack straps.

[John S.]

Sorry if I offended. The 303 website is a little hard to interpret when it comes to nylon fabric. Their MSDS did say it's not for textiles or unfinished leather (suede), which I guess nylon doesn't really fit? One area showed products for outdoor fabrics only included the fabric guard. Your experience seems to show it is safe for nylon.

[Connie Dodson]

My experience is entirely good.

Misunderstanding is understandable.

Their website is huge. The fabric product offering is relatively new.

In one place, they state manufacturers haven't given them testing results for ripstop nylon. In another place, a kitemaker page at their website, they like 303 Aerospace Protectorant for their thin nylon fabric.

I suspect the fabric specific product may work best of all with the new coated fabrics.

I did send an email query, listing specific fabrics for backpacking.

I didn't think to ask about FR (fire retardant) tent fabric.

[Henry Shires / Tarptent]

I'm late to the party here but wanted to share our experience re: zipper sliders.

There's a very close correlation between dust levels and zipper slider failure. We see sliders start to go on the PCT and CDT much faster than they go on the (much less dusty) AT. Dust/grime in the zipper teeth will physically spread apart the sliders and you'll notice that the zipper teeth start to have trouble locking. The short term fix is to clean your zippers and then use a small pair of pliers to slowly and carefully crimp the "jaws" of the slider(s) back together. By jaws I mean the wider, flared part of the slider that you can actually grab with pliers. Squeeze the top to the bottom, both right and left sides, slowly and carefully and then test. Repeat until the zipper starts to function properly. The longer term fix is to replace the slider. The good news is that it's a do-it-yourself project. We recommend cutting through the zipper teeth right at the zipper end and then sliding the problem slider out through the slit. Make the cut in the teeth on the narrow side of the slider so that you can insert a new slider back onto the teeth. Once you have inserted a new slider, sew up the slit with a few stitches to prevent the slider from coming off.

The best prevention against slider failure is to keep your zippers clean. Wipe them down after use and keep them lubricated.

For any Tarptent owners with problem zippers, we're happy to send out new sliders and a one-page instruction sheet.

Thanks.

-H

[Jerry Adams]

Thanks Henry

I occasionally throw something away that still has some life in it.

When you say "cutting through the zipper teeth right at the zipper end", do you mean at the top of a jacket or the bottom of a tent door? That is, where the stop is, and just zip the slider off the end of the zipper?

[Henry Shires / Tarptent]

> When you say "cutting through the zipper teeth right at the zipper end", do you mean at the top of a jacket or the bottom of a tent door? That is, where the stop is, and just zip the slider off the end of the zipper?

Wherever the slider naturally slides to when you open the zipper all the way. That's the narrow end of the slider–the side where the teeth come out locked once they've passed through the slider. In the case of a jacket with separating zipper, it's probably better to do it right and unstitch the end (at your waist level) where you first start to slide up but the same principle applies.

[Author]

Posts