Backpacking for the girly girl

[Brad Rogers]

For food check out Sarbar's Freezerbag Cooking or Pack-it Gourmet's website. They have nice pre packaged meals that are very good.

[Bryce]

Thanks for your concern John, but we moved in a few months ago and are going strong. If anything we'll just concentrate on things we both like to do outside of backpacking and ignore certain downers. ;)

Bradford, thanks for the food ideas. I'm 1/2 Vegan now because…well….that's what she cooks at night and it tastes good. haha. I'd like a little more protein in our diet, so I'll have a look at that website and do some research.

[Mark Ries]

I agree. She does not have to backpack for you guys to have a great life and forcing this could be the end. I would take it slow and easy and make it rewarding like great scenery without much work and you make sure that you do for her things that she wants that you would not normally do. I would definatly not get her right into UL backpacking Dont make her deal with every aspect of this at once. Start with a very short hike on a perfect day and if this works out try a little more.

[Mark Ries]

Sounds like you got the right idea Bryce

[Bryce]

No, she does not ~have~ to backpack, but we both try to do things together when we can and realize we both need alone time as well. I've never seen art until I met her. :)

I will try to find a relatively light full floor tent to borrow from a friend and work that into my plan:
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=50465&skip_to_post=427445#427445

[CW]

Buy Mike C's latest book, if for nothing else than the recipes. It's vegetarian but you could easily make that vegan.

[Mark Ries]

Hey Bryce I got a Walrus Zoid 2 would loan free if you paid shipping its just over 4 pounds (gulp) but closes up nice and has a lot of coverage very high bathtub floor If you cant find any thing lighter

[Roleigh Martin]

I think the Haven Tarp/Net Tent or equivalent (where the tarp is cuben fiber) is the ideal solution. A good double wall, ultralight tent for two.

I looked at the MLD Duo Mid with its Dual Inner Net and the difference is so negligible in ounces. I like the interior spaciousness of the Haven Tarp. I say go for the Haven Tarp with the Net Tent inner too. (by sixmoondesigns.com)

http://tinyurl.com/6d4jg87

[Tim Zen]

Bryce — think long term here. Ten years from now, three kids and you need some quiet time. Try negotiating a seven day outing at this point.

Ah well, you kids will figure it out. Have fun.

(BTW — NPS has the best out houses according to my gals)

[John Whynot]

What's wrong with hiking to a backcountry cabin or hut?

Consider Upper Goose Pond cabin or Bascom Lodge on the AT in Massachusetts. How about the AMC huts in the White Mountains? If you stay at the huts during caretaker season, the cost is more reasonable…

[Richard Lyon]

Kathleen,

I applaud your attitude and desire to share backpacking with Bryce. But I think it's a bad idea – a view based on intimate personal experience.

I was in the same fortunate situation many years ago with a woman who wanted to go backpacking with me, for the same reasons. Not only a good sport, she's an athletic woman who doesn't need a hair dryer every day. I liked camping and she thought she'd like it because I did. We planned the trip together so that it wouldn't be too tough, and we'd have great scenery and good weather. After a lovely hike in we set up camp and it started raining, rain that continued until about 3 am, when it turned to now (in August in Colorado). After two wet and miserable evenings we bailed, to a bed and breakfast with clean sheets and a hot shower. That was the end of her very brief backpacking career.

I really think this is genetic – some wonderful people just aren't meant for backpacking. If you insist on going, start out with some long day hikes, from a rustic cabin or B & B. Pack a real picnic lunch, or dinner if you're somewhere it stays light until 10 pm. Try camping under the stars in your back yard. Whatever you do, do NOT try anything radical until you've car camped or backyard camped and survived.

Bryce, I'd avise the biggest tent you can find – don't even think about UL. Same with food and other amenities. Some things are worth more than winning the latest weight contest.

Richard

[Bryce]

@Tim, we're Childfree by choice (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childfree) so no kids for us, but yeah at some point we may be sick of each other (tomorrow? :p).

For those of you suggesting huts, I've seen them referenced on sectionhiker.com and farther North from us, but nothing I can find on a trail I know of within ~2-3 hours. Will have to look more.

[John Whynot]

Upper Goose Pond cabin is about 50 miles north of Salisbury, CT on the AT, it's a fairly short walk from several road crossings. Bascom Lodge is on the summit of Mt Greylock, which has road access, and is near North Adams, MA…

[Bryce]

Thanks for the info… I'll check some of these out:

http://www.outdoors.org/lodging/cabins-campgrounds/

[Jeffs Eleven]

Bryce- You gotta crawl before you walk.

She is new to camping. She will not be down with true UL tents. I say +1 Scarp 2. Or meet in the middle with the TTDR. Weigh the pros and cons of 3lbs vs. her being uncomfortable and in your ear about it for the entire trip because it WILL be your fault. You can get away with UL everything else- just not a tent. It will benefit both of you to have a 'whole' tent.

Plus, it will show your commitment. ;)

[Mary D]

For what it's worth, Kathleen, my mother was a city girl and I'm sure she never peed outside until she was 38. At that time she and my father (he was a small town boy) decided to go backpacking in the "Black Forest" of Pennsylvania. I was 6. It's a wonder we survived, since they both basically knew nothing about what they were getting into (at least I had an excuse, lol!). They did just fine, though, and this adventure started a deep love for the outdoors and wilderness that my mother never lost until her death! It did the same for me!

I don't recommend you start that way, though! That's like throwing someone into deep water and hoping he will learn to swim! Instead, try car camping combined with short dayhikes. When you get more comfortable with the car-camping gear you have, switch over to your backpacking gear when car-camping. Work into backpacking very gradually, starting with just one night (with a good weather forecast) a couple of miles from the trailhead. Keep it fun (Bryce, make sure you keep it fun!). Eventually (probably during the dayhikes) you'll learn to cope with bugs, rain, cold and, yes, peeing outdoors, and still enjoy yourself. Just don't go at it too fast! I suspect you are a lot tougher than you think you are!

You can get a single wall, fully enclosed, bugproof tent with a real floor for 34 oz., including stuff sack and stakes (Tarptent Squall 2). Not ultralight, but definitely light weight, and a lot more room inside than the lighter double-wall 2 person tents.

PS: I grew up out in the wilds, and I still hate bugs!!! In addition to the fully screened tent, I won't go out without repellent and a bug headnet.

[Brian Lindahl]

A mid and inner net tent sounds like the best option to me. It functions just like a normal tent, and it'll allow you to leave the inner net tent behind and use the mid for winter backpacking. That said, I use a Double Rainbow for couples camping, since I ski in the winter.

[Larry Dyer]

I concur with the MLD option.

My wife is the reason I own a Trailstar (that and I'd wanted one for ages). Now I just need that Bearpaw inner net.

[Andy F]

Get a Scarp 2 with both inner tents (mesh and solid). That way, you can use it for those deep winter trips you'll both be taking in a few years! ;)

[Kathleen L]

I really appreciate it. Bryce and I are discussing options for a weekend trip. We'll let you know what we decide :)

[Konrad .]

Kathleen, congrats on taking these first steps in pursuing what will definitely turn out to be a great adventure.

But first, your quote: "I'm often sitting next to him on the couch as he reads and posts for hours on end…like I'm not even there! "
Ugh, i've been very guilty of that myself a few times, so it made me laugh a bit as it struck a chord.

I took my girlfriend out backpacking for the first time in her life when she was 26. Like you, she fears/despises certain aspects of camping. The bathroom thing has been an issue. What has helped tremendously is this following product.
http://www.rei.com/product/407267/sani-fem-freshette-feminine-urinary-director

She feels that it makes things easier, cleaner, and faster

In terms of tents…yeah she will never do a floorless shelter either. We use a tarptent Double Rainbow, with zero complaints. It's as traditional of a tent as you're going to get, but with UL fabrics, and a respectable weight. It's clearly not the only option out there, but it happens to be a tent that we have, and works well. It's also extremely livable, which 2 doors and 2 vestibules. A nice "his" and "hers" and no need to crawl over each other in the middle of night to take a leak. We went from a 5lb sierra designs traditional tent to the Double Rainbow and my girlfriend wasn't even phased…they were the same in her book. 2.5 lbs, or split up the poles from the body, and it's even lighter per person now. We've tried to go with a lighter tent in the past (cuben duomid with duo inner nettent) but it just wasn't as livable for 2 adults…it was worth the bump in weight to live comfortably.

Our first trek together was to 13 Falls in the Pemi Wilderness area of NH. A very easy, gradual hike, with an opportunity to camp outdoors in a somewhat secluded site. There was also an outhouse which made things easier for first timers. You could simply do a there and back to get a feel for the outdoors…no need to summit any peaks.

If you're feeling ambitious, you can always do mt liberty in NH. This one is steeper and a bit more aggressive, but it also offers a nice tent site (liberty tent site) and an outhouse. If you make it to the tent site, you can easily tag the summit, which is only .6 miles away.

You're gonna have a lot of fun! You might love the outdoors. After only a year of outings, my girlfriend will be joining me on the John Muir Trail this September…but who knows what 21 days will do to us :D

I haven't had a chance to read all the posts, so please forgive me if I've missed some details. But I would highly recommend just testing the waters first with some day hikes. Maybe even some aggressive steep day hikes just to get an idea of some of the hardships. The worst would be to not enjoy the activity, and then be forced to spend a night out there on top of it all. Also, do you enjoy photography? A camera can add a different level of appreciation to the outdoors. I enjoy sleeping outdoors, the gear (of course) and the views, and those would be my main motivations for going outside. Whereas my girlfriend truly enjoys photography, which provides her with her very own form of incentive to get out there. It's great that you're doing this for your boyfriend, but I think it's valuable to find something that you can take away for yourself at the end of the day. Have fun!

Another thing that I find helpful in making the trip enjoyable for the both of us is splitting the responsibility. The first couple of trips, my GF admitted that she felt like she was tagging along on "my" trip, which kind of bothered her. She would watch me boil the water, set up the tent, hang the bear bag, etc etc. These things are not rocket science by all means, and can easily be learned and taught. I would encourage you guys to share your knowledge of equipment and tasks with one another, which would make these tasks more engaging and efficient .

Cheers! (and wait for perfect weather)

[Greg F]

I would assess your ultralight philosphy. I could be wrong but it seems like for your personal backpacking your goal is to go out and hike with as little gear and as light of gear as possible as an end to itself.

Now I think your goal for your trip with your girlfriend is to introduce her to backpacking in an enjoyable way so that she will go on the odd trip with you.

In my opinion the key to UL is to tailor your gear to accomplish your trips goal. You have very effectively done this for your personal goal but seem a little resistant to attacking your second goal in the same manner.

My other piece of advice would be for both of you to share in the decision making in terms of what gear to bring, what level of comfort, and what level of redundency. Last weekend I went backpacking with one of my friends who hadn't been before and he wanted to bring a 2lb can of tomatos for a pasta dish. I suggested some alternatives for freeze dried food but he wanted his tomatos so he carried it I bit my tounge and cooked some amazing freezer bag tacos the second night to show that you can have good freeze dried food. Next time he will try to substitute the canned goods with lighter options.

A couple of things that make the transition to backpacking easier are good weather, good views, short distances, and easy trails. I wouldn't go more than 1 day from the trailhead so that you can bail any day if the weather turns.

For a sleeping bag get one warmer than required and error on the to much insulation side because nothing is worse than being cold. I would also bring full rain gear even if the weather forcast is good because the only thing worse than being cold is cold and wet.

So by adding say 8 oz on the sleeping bag 1lb on the tent and an extra lb of clothing you add about 2.5 lbs of total weight you add alot of comfort for your first backpack trip

[Linda Alvarez]

For what it's worth, I say skip the car camping and hut camping and get right out into the backcountry on a short trip. I used to be Kathleen — I mean, not exactly the girly girl part, but I was not keen on slogging a pack into the wilderness and cozying up to the creepy crawly critters. My ex-boyfriend and I used to negotiate on our cross-country trips–a night at a hotel, a night at a campground. I couldn't wait to wash the grime off me on "my" nights and sleep in a warm bed.

What finally made me warm up to backpacking was how it enabled us to get OUT THERE, to spectacular places –not crowded car camping spots with dirty pit toilets and lots of RVs. Waking up next to an alpine lake and seeing the reflection of the mountains in the sunrise, stopping for lunch overlooking a spectacular remote canyon or alongside a rushing river, with no one else around, those are the moments that made it all worth it to me.

I also +100 whoever posted above that doing your business under the open sky in the mountains is a million times better than any rank pit toilet will ever be. Seriously, it's not a big deal.

Ok, back to tents…I am actually with Kathleen on this one! I have never gotten over the heebie jeebies about having creepy crawlies in my bed. When I sleep on the ground I never sleep a wink, imagining bugs slinking into my bag with me, feeling imaginary ant feet parading across my forehead. If Kathleen is trying to share something she loves with you, Bryce, meet her halfway and get her a tent that will be of comfort to her. Tents are cozy! I love being in a tent at night with someone I love. Plus hey Bryce, they are nice and private, nudge-nudge-wink-wink! One advantage you have as a couple is that you can buy something cozy and not have to worry as much about floorspace. Something like a Sierra Designs Vapor Light (~3.5 pounds trail weight) or the BA tents or a Hubba Hubba will feel more like what she's used to.

The rest of my advice is just to try shorter outings at first — one night out, that kind of thing. And while you can of course leave the extras behind, keeping some creature comforts–a comfortable and warm pad, pillow, chocolate-chip cookies, will go a long way toward making backpacking fun instead of a just a death march and exercise in minimalism. When I get too wrapped up in counting the ounces (I stopped myself yesterday about to purchase a rain jacket for $114 that was 2 oz. lighter than the perfectly good one I have…) I remind myself that a single cup of water weighs ~8 ounces.

Let her pick out her gear too (with your counsel of course). Remember girly girls love to shop! It can be kind of fun to get your own mug or cool micro-stove or headlamp … it also gets me excited about going out and using the stuff!

I hope you learn to love backpacking as much as I do, Kathleen! Good luck and I look forward to your first trip report!

[Daniel Yaris]

my first UL trip and gear

though I had a 10lb pack I was comfy (thermarest, sleeping bag, and tent with floor.)

here is the link
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=50422

[Dale Wambaugh]

C'mon kids, go for a couple nice day hikes and have a nice stay in a lodge. Nothing like a calf-burner hike followed up with a soak in a hot tub and a glass or two of your favorite Merlot.

Of course, you might get the bug once you see the Great Outdoors and share in the glory of Creation. The idea isn't to pee outdoors, it's just something you might have to do in order to see waterfalls, wildflowers and eagles overhead. You might enjoy the physical challenge and the reward of topping out on a ridge with a view of three counties. If you can navigate the traffic, panhandlers, dirt and noise of an inner-city street to see the Renoir exhibit, you can walk up a trail!

Sleeping overnight is just a way to extend the joy. If he's good, he'll deliver fresh hot coffee with the sunrise. There's nothing like waking up on a crisp mountain morning with the cool air on your face while the rest is toasty in your sleeping bag. It is empowering to be able to read maps, climb mountains and be self-reliant in the outdoors. A few bugs and a little sweat are just the admission fee.

[Author]

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