Big, Heavy Packs

[Mike W]

…

[James Marco]

1. Why do you consider yourself serious?
Backpacking is only a means to an end. Climbing a mountain. Portaging to a lake to take pictures of the eagles. Hiking up to a meadow to catch the flowers. Enjoying the view from a hill top. Hiking to a stream for a weekend of fishing. It forms the basis for getting out.

2. What pack do you use for serious backpacking?
My needs depend on what I am doing. I rarely have a need for 20# these days. A Gossamer Gear Miniposa *usually* works. For light loads(<12#) a Gossamer Gear G5. For heavy loads (25-30#,) an Osprey Atmos. For huge loads a Gregory Baltoro(30-50#.)

3. Do you still use something like this, or would you be in the market for one again?
I might need 35#, I have to teach my grandson to hike and camp.

[Scott Lehr]

Never take me seriously……unless im being serious.

[Steven McAllister]

And I will not settle for anything less than:
Flextrek 37 Trillion

Sorry. I had to post it again:-(

[Steven McAllister]

One example of why you might want a "serious" backpack is doing trail maintenance. Carrying a chainsaw and other tools.

Here is a picture of me after doing shelter cleanup after a group left garbage behind. I think I had 50+ lbs in an SMD Starlight:

[Mark Ryan]

On another nameless forum dedicated to thru hiking, I have seen this term thrown around a lot. Speaking from my experience on said forum, it seems to refer to anyone that carries 40-50lb packs. Unfortunately, on said forum, anyone carrying 20lbs or less is not a "serious backpacker" People can get bent out of shape when it comes to this apparently.

If you enjoy what you do, and put some passion into it, then you are serious. Applies to everything and anything.

PS-I know my profile pic doesn't help.

[Unknown abc]

That video is absolutely hilarious, Steve!

[Robert Larue]

None of the big companies care about anything but making sales. The 7 pound "Ultralight" backpack is just a name. They're marketed with the sales pitch "for the serious backpacker" to justify a hefty price. You're serious about something when you're prepared to drop some serious cash… obviously! Serious drivers own BMWs and Escalades.

How often do you see that 20 year old girl at REI with her mother getting advice from the salesperson about which bag to buy for her "backpacking" trip in Europe?? I see it every time I go to MEC here in Canada. Would she ever buy something that looks like a MLD or Gossamer Gear backpack? No way – it's not good enough for her little girl. They don't have any fancy parts, shiny zippers or colorful booklets explaining the high-tech features. These people buy the bag that looks like the most expensive model, but that's a little cheaper – like the REI or MEC house brand version.

The other people who drop a lot of cash are those who walk into a high end gear store at a mountain resort. They have a buddy who's asked them to go on a weekend trip and they need everything right then and there. Again, only the best will do. If you're the salesperson, what do you give them? A 100$ tube with straps that won't be able to handle everything they buy, or the newest, top of the line 500$ Arcteryx model and a Mountain Hardwear tent? I'm sure rent is expensive in Vail…

Demand = supply.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

THEN> Back in the '90s I got a Dana Designs Terraplane. That sucker weighs 7.4 lbs in size Large! But it WAS comfortable. Now it's only used for winter trips, for which it's perfect for the heavier, bulkier winter gear . Also I used an MSR Dragonfly stove (their heaviest). Like the Terraplane pack, it's now a winter-only item.

TODAY> Now I carry a 3.2 lb REI Cruise Ul 60 for 3 season use.

**UL AWAKENING**

When I moved from Pennsylvania to Nevada in 2004 and found the UL websites my entire mindset changed. TarpTent Contrail and then TT Moment, WM Megalite bag, Vargo JetTi canister stove, Merrill Moab shoes and boots, etc. Perhaps not UL but certainly LIGHT.

Thank you BPL!

P.S. "Serious backpacker??" C'mon, life is too serious to take seriously.

[Evan McCarthy]

1. Why do you consider yourself serious?

I'm almost never serious but I backpack a lot . . . and since I lead a backpacking meetup out of DC, I have to deal with tons of people stuck in the paradign of heavy packs and redundant loads. Several other backpacking groups in the area occasionally claim that for a winter outing "backpackers must have and be able to carry a 50 pound pack" or "must have full waterproof boots." According to these standards, I am not allowed to attend their 12 mile (total mileage!) weekend outing. Not that I care or would want to. I do much different weekend trips.

2. What pack do you use for serious backpacking?

I use an MLD Burn — and despite intial reservations about its size, I'm committed to making it work all winter long, plus a week long trek later this spring. If I can make one of the smallest packs on the market comfortably carry everything I need for 4-season use, I'm sure others can make do with some version of smaller and lighter packs.

3. Do you still use something like this, or would you be in the market for one again?

I love the Burn. If someone handed me a bigger MLD pack I would probably use it. But for now, god bless the Burn.

[David Ure]

"The 7 pound "Ultralight" backpack is just a name."

The link that RJ provided was a bit of a 'set up.' MR makes these packs because there is a demand for them. Based on the miniscule marketing budget of the company, I suspect that they aren't forcing this product down anyone's throat. As an FYI, they do make a 4lb, 75L pack with full suspension.

I did a quick run down through Gregory, Osprey, et al, and it seems that these companies are producing packs that would garner envy from all parts of the backpacking spectrum. By covering all bases, they sell more gear which is why they are in business in the first place. But even amongst these brands, I could not find 7lb packs, with the average weight about 1/2 that for 60L.

[Andy F]

"What disturbs me is that these packs are sold primarily to those who consider themselves "serious backpackers" who carry 50+ lb loads."

It sounds like they're very serious indeed about packing stuff on their back.

"1. Why do you consider yourself serious?
2. What pack do you use for serious backpacking?
3. Do you still use something like this, or would you be in the market for one again?"

1. I'm not serious about packing stuff on my back. I like to enjoy nature and the experience. Gear is a luxury which allows me to avoid spending most of my time building a shelter or maintaining a fire all night to stay warm.

2. When forced to be overly-encumbered by material possessions when I carry nearly all of the gear for my family of 6, I use a 6.5 lb Kelty Red Cloud 6650 backpack.

3. No, assuming I'm able to avoid heavy artillery shells and larger munitions with my Kelty pack. :)

Don't laugh. It could happen. ;-)

[Donald Browning]

To be honest, I love this forum and learn a lot. I consider myself a serious backpacker because I get out about twice a month, and spend a good deal of my treasure and thinking about backpacking. I am also a gear testing crazy-man, and I've had or have about every pack you might think of or one like it. With that said, I've gotten to love this 'ole heavy pack. I usually go out with my daughter (7yrs old) and my sheepdog, and we all like our creature comforts for the one or two night forays into the wilderness. I mean how many of you have packed watercolors, a frisbee, a dog bowl, and two ipods into the woods? I love this pack because I can come home on Friday, rushed as he!!, and throw everything possible into it and never run out of room, and be in warm tent before midnight in some beautiful country. There it is, I'm lazy in the planning dept, and loving the time with my daughter.

[Chad Miller]

For those of you who took the time to say that you're a 'serious' backpacker then went on to explain why . . . .

You're not a serious backpacker. You're just some backpacker who needs try and prove to others that you're serious.

[Matthew Zion]

1. I'd call it obsessed.
2. Custom HMG Windrider is my new thru hike bag.
3. I would never, ever, carry something so big and ridiculous.

[Hikin’ Jim]

Why do people carry "Big, Heavy" packs?

First, most of the gear I see here I had never even heard of before. You'll never see the stuff discussed here in a Sport Chalet or REI (the two retailers near me). UL gear suffers from a problem of obscurity to the general public.

Second, BUDGET, BUDGET, BUDGET. Before I was making decent money, I'd do garage sales, cast offs from friends, sales, whatever. Beggars can't be choosers. The most common stuff is, you guessed it, heavy.

Third, it's a BIG leap of faith to start buying gear over the internet that without trying it on/out first. I've wound up with stuff I didn't like. Yeah, I can Gear Swap it — at a loss. I see a lot of people here who are super experimenters, constantly striving to lower their skin out weight. Most of the people I know won't take/don't have the time to do that.

Fourth, it's just plain hard work to lighten up. I bought a lighter pack, a lighter pad, a lighter bag, and a lighter shelter. I struggled to get my pack weight down to 38lbs (total weight incl. food, water, and fuel), and I made some compromises that left me a little nervous (carrying an Ur Sack instead of a bear canister in Sequoia Nat'l Park for example).

It's a huge, nay, HUGE change of mindset for someone like me who started hiking and backpacking in the 60's. It ain't easy.

Having said that, my 50lbs days are THANK GOD over and I can't see myself needing a pack as large as the one Ryan posted even for a winter trip.

HJ

[James Lantz]

I think you are serious when you are a member of this community, asking questions, helping others, & constantly trying to improve your technique to enhance your enjoyment of the outdoors. This journey is different for everyone, but for me its highest expression so far has been a 4 day trip with 12 lbs carried in a Gossamer Gear Murmur. I've done the external ladder frame behemoth 60 lb pack from my Boy Scout days until 4 yrs ago & have no desire to return to that misery.

[Franco Darioli]

Ron
Thank you for N1
(I do think that some need to lighten up a bit…)

David
The Osprey Argon (only 110L…) is around 6.5lbs and regularly sold here in Melbourne (and probably more so in Tasmania)

Hiking Jim
Yes that was huge

But if you are serious , the Flextrek 37 Trillion now has a built in Super Gyro Stabiliser (Patent pending but only just) to avoid some of the slight swing you had in the previous version.
It should be on show at Salt Lake City right now..
How about reporting on this one Mr Jordan , or are you afraid of the competition ?
Franco

[Anonymous]

"What in the world does anyone do with an 85 liter pack?"

Climb very big mountains in remote locations.

[Chad Miller]

With the exception of a few of you you're all taking this way too seriously.

[Anonymous]

"You're not a serious backpacker. You're just some backpacker who needs try and prove to others that you're serious."

Thanks for setting us straight, Chad.

[Anonymous]

"With the exception of a few of you you're all taking this way too seriously."

Ahem, uh, present company excepted of course. ;-]

[EndoftheTrail]

I don't care how big the mountain, Tom, I am not hauling an 85L pack!! :)

[Nick Gatel]

I am not a serious backpacker. Oh, I have done a lot of it, some short trips and some long trips. I only do it because it makes me happy. I do it for my own pleasure.

And why should we question anyone who wants to hang a category to backpacking, such as "serious?" Many of us here are guilty of the same. Light, UL, SUL, etc. There is some gratification to get to a certain predetermined category of "lightness" by many people here. I have been guilty of it too.

The pack I take on any trip is the one in my inventory that will do the job best, will last, and will be comfortable. It weighs what it weighs. Form (and weight) follow function. It is the one piece of equipment we usually spend the majority of our backpacking time using. I do not take lug nuts off my car with a hammer, and I do not drive nails with my torque wrench. Some would say the Abaroka is a big heavy pack, others consider it ultralight and not serious, and some consider it perfect for a particular hike. It doesn't matter what others think, if it is the right pack for you. We need to do our research and purchase the gear that fits our individual needs and wants the best… not what some "expert" tells is best for us.

I think most pack manufacturers are in the business to make a profit. And selling price points are usually set by gross profit margin percentages. In other words, Gregory makes a lot more money (dollars) on a Denali Pro 105 than a Z55. And if the entire backpacking world wanted packs that weigh less than 20 oz, companies like Gregory would go out of business. I am not picking on Gregory.

Today we live in a "risk adverse" society, and many backpackers carry stuff for every conceivable emergency or discomfort. Need a big heavy pack for that.

Lastly, lets not forget the "macho" advertising message to the "serious" backpacker who can toil under 50+ plus pounds, when 15 lbs would be more than adequate.

So what do I think about those who consider themselves serious backpackers? I don't think about them :)

Let us not forget that most of the BPL community is on the fringe of the backpacking world. We are a minority. I have no interest in converting the rest of the world to the glorious world of lightening up. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy discussing gear as much as the next person. But I do not consider it serious conversation.

But this is a good subject for discussion. Thanks for the post.

[Ron Babington]

Rough day, Chad?

[Author]

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