Nov 17, 2010 at 1:47 pm #1265606
The is a general notification to anyone who has purchased or is looking to purchase GoLite gear from Backpacking Light member, John Devitt. John has been attending our warehouse sales for a while now.
At each sale John has multiple stories for managers and staff on why he would like to buy many items in bulk. At our Colorado Springs Sale John stated that he was buying for a Boy Scout Troop. That product actually ended up being sold at a significant markup (over his purchase price) on multiple websites including this one. At our current Boulder sale John informed me that he was buying for family and friends…This product is now marked up on this website.
This post is to make sure that you are not being taken advantage by John and paying prices that are significantly greater than John has paid at the sales.
If you do want to purchase a GoLite item from John, I would ask to pay the price that he paid at the warehouse sale…which is close to 50% off of the retail.
I have sent John the following PM below.
I helped you at the GoLite warehouse sale last night. I am one of GoLite's North American Asst. Sales Managers. I now understand the reason you have spent over $3000 at the sale so far…in order to sell it at a mark up on multiple websites.
That said, you are no longer welcome back to any of our sales. You are marking up our products, over the sale price, in order to make money for yourself and you ARE NOT AN AUTHORIZED RESELLER.
If we see you at any future sales or swipe your credit card, you will be asked to leave and will be escorted out.
The GoLite warehouse sale is not meant to be used as a wholesale source for you to make extra money.
Thank you.Nov 17, 2010 at 1:55 pm #1665330
Ho.. This is gonna get nasty!
;DNov 17, 2010 at 2:02 pm #1665334Nov 17, 2010 at 2:05 pm #1665337
With all due respect, what does it matter to you what he does with the gear once he has purchased it from the Golite sale? I don't believe he has claimed to be an authorized dealer. I also believe he is still selling the gear at a substantial discount from retail. Where's the problem?
I do not like the fact that he lied to you about his intent, but I don't think you had any business asking the question in the first place unless it was just idle chit-chat.
Unless you have a policy strictly forbidding this, he didn't do anything wrong. And if you do a have a policy against this, does this mean you are going to yell at me if I try to sell a piece of Golite gear?Nov 17, 2010 at 2:19 pm #1665352
"Unless you have a policy strictly forbidding this, he didn't do anything wrong."
Most companies try to protect their retail dealers by setting pricing and controlling distribution. If a bricks and mortar, or a web based dealer, starts undercutting they will get a call.
At the Golite Sale the questions were asked to determine destination of their goods, for the same reason. Golite offered everybody a break with the sale. Good for them. Golite extended themselves for a "good cause" – Boy Scouts – Good for Them.
Now they are protecting their market, their distribution, and their retailers, all critical to the longevity of their business. Good for them.
I don't buy much Golite product, but I don't want to see any company handicapped by someone taking advantage of a good thing. That screws the company, the other folks in the world, and ultimately me.Nov 17, 2010 at 2:20 pm #1665354
@fuzzLocale: Sunny San Diego
+1 to Greg's comment. There's use…and there's abuse.Nov 17, 2010 at 2:21 pm #1665355
drowning in spamMember
Mike, thank you.Nov 17, 2010 at 2:26 pm #1665357
@shireeLocale: Southeastern US
I was extremely close to buying a golite 20 from him the other day. I am glad that I didn't. Not just because of his direct lying myself and to others on this forum, but this shows that he most likely would be unreliable if something went wrong.
c'mon man.Nov 17, 2010 at 2:42 pm #1665362
@sharaldsLocale: Gallatin Range
Thank you for alerting the BPL Staff of this issue.Nov 17, 2010 at 2:42 pm #1665363
@rbeardLocale: ATL, Southern Appalachia
i bot a shangri la 1 tarp from him and he was a nice guy. paid $90 shipped for it which is a deal. but i understand the point. he will sell no more.
QUESTION TO MODERATOR: would re-selling this tarp on gear swap be the equivalent to selling stolen goods? tiaNov 17, 2010 at 2:44 pm #1665364
@dan_quixoteLocale: below the mountains (AK)
…except maybe his customers.
Although, they do make markets more efficient, technically speaking.
Lying isn't cool though.Nov 17, 2010 at 3:01 pm #1665370
FWIW, I'd personally recommend just leaving this thread alone and not posting any more comments, or on either of the other two threads Mike posted to on this subject.Nov 17, 2010 at 3:15 pm #1665376
In John's defense, he was somewhat clear on this site that he had purchased the items from the GoLite sale and was marking them up. I understood this because he posted it early on. John wrote:
"I like to use Golite gear and I pick up some extra items at the sales to pass on deals and to help defray the cost of my purchases.
Yes, I waited 4 hours at the sale for the doors to open."
I can see GoLite being upset that they were lied to and that someone used their sale as an opportunity to pick up large volumes for re-sale. John's transaction with them may not have been totally ethical, but his transactions on here seem to fair IMO. I think a lot of people who don't live near GoLite are glad to have the chance just to obtain these out of production items even if it's not at 50% off.
Mike: You guys should bring back 4oz Reed pants, the Ion and lighter quilt fabrics etc so there isn't so much pent up demand on here :)Nov 17, 2010 at 3:21 pm #1665377
@philoconnorLocale: Oh ya know
Look at the Gear Swap Forum… I mean cmon I knew this was coming.
However, its better coming from someone from the source rather than a member who smelled something fishy.Nov 17, 2010 at 3:52 pm #1665394
@kgottshalkLocale: Colorado, USA
Totally agree with Dan Durston's view above.Nov 17, 2010 at 4:25 pm #1665410
@alanyork9Locale: PIEDMONT N.C.
Maybe Golite could post rules and conditions at the sale if they want to limit what a buyer can do with their products after they are purchased.I bought a SL3 on Sierra Trading Post for $80. If I choose to sell it for whatever the market will pay…that is my right in America.Let him sell!Nov 17, 2010 at 4:40 pm #1665414
+1 Dan and Alan, I almost bought a Utopia 2 from him, wished I had seeing as I live about a 1000 miles from the source. So much for the free market…Nov 17, 2010 at 4:42 pm #1665416
@cobbermanLocale: Northern Colorado
I guess I don't see an issue with reselling gear purchased at a GoLite Warehouse Sale/Patagonia Outlet Sale/REI Garage Sale etc. The only way the retailers can force out someone like John would be to put a purchase cap into place. If someone you know, like John, spends $3000 at such a sale that alone should raise your concern as to their intent. The only reasons which I could understand other than them passing on those items at markup, would be a scout troop leader, college adventure group, church group, or other outdoor group. Does this mean I can't sell my display model Seedhouse SL2 at a markup? How about that new R1 hoody at the Patagonia Outlet sale I passed up last week for $60… I bet I could have sold that for a profit.
So long as the seller notifies us properly about the item's origin… let the buyers decide if there's a market for such people.Nov 17, 2010 at 4:48 pm #1665421
@winterwarlockLocale: Western NY
I have mixed feelings about this…yes, the goods sold were still at good prices, and I haven't seen anything to indicate he hasn't delivered what was promised.
However, having spent my career managing overlapping channels of distribution, most manufacturers have ideas of what their route to market ought to be. In many cases, authorized resellers are required to buy and hold inventory, run specific promotions, and are encumbered by a reseller agreement. That's not anti-capitalism…it's the way to protect a brand and the manufacturer's investment. As another example, when Victorinox first launched their watches in the US, they had very strict rules about pricing, sales, etc…and actively pursued anyone who violated that. Back to GoLite – if you're a reseller like Backcountry.com,. for example, you buy into the program expecting to do a certain amount of business…if that is undercut by someone who doesn't pay for advertising, but snipes away some of your business, you may give up your legitmate business in favor of the grey market. But now GoLite has lost a likely larger reseller in favor of an occasional reseller like John here.
I do see both sides, but believe GoLite can set whatever policy they want. However, the deception is the problem I see, and if John felt what he was doing was legitimate, why didn't he simply tell them his plan?Nov 17, 2010 at 5:30 pm #1665442
Shouldn't Golite be paying him for being the Pied Piper of Golite?
Aren't we all friends and family here on BPL? :) If he's offering us better deals than we can get ourselves, aren't we all benefiting? I could spend 2 hours and $10 driving to Boulder and waiting in line for 4 hours but buying on here seems like a way better deal. If you'd rather pay more or spend a lot of time in line, that's up to you.
So Golite asks you why you are buying an item if you go to their sales?
How is this hurting Golite? Wouldn't they have sold the items to someone else anyway? Aren't these closeouts and prototypes and such? I don't think this is anything like a reseller undercutting prices.
I bought a Utopia 1 prototype from him and it didn't match the U1 specs (12" short). He said he would absolutely make it right and left it up to me. I decided to keep it as it was 30% of retail price and I'm not tall anyway. But it shows you can trust John in a transaction. I wouldn't worry about that one bit.Nov 17, 2010 at 5:50 pm #1665448
If a company is going to sell products marked down like that, can they not label the items in some way that shows how they were purchased? Action taken problem solved!
It is a good thing for Golite to have the sales and help people learn about their products, but they seem to have brought this on themselves. Someone drops 3 grand on items and buys many of the same item and Golite gladly swipes that credit card and says thank you? $200 tents and sleeping bags for boy scouts? Then they all pop up for sale on the internet. Shocking!
I won't buy any of the items from the guy but Golite did not handle this very well at all. You have to make up the rules before the game starts. They are his items and unless he lied about tax exemptions or something, no one can call him a crook, just a greedy person.Nov 17, 2010 at 5:52 pm #1665451
It would just be nice to have the truth laid out in the initial posting of an item for sale.
Dishonesty, whether to a company big or small, or to an individual is flat wrong.
There is no justification for lying…not to mention for profit.
I do not care if someone wants to make money reselling something. If I see a value in the item, I will buy it regardless of the profit the seller will make.
That being said, I am glad I did not wait in a line for 4 hours only to find out the people in front of me bought everything I wanted only to resell it at markup.Nov 17, 2010 at 5:57 pm #1665453
"…but Golite did not handle this very well at all."
Golite did ask. He lied. They caught on. Game over.Nov 17, 2010 at 6:14 pm #1665462
Not to stir the pot but this is not reselling used gear this is a business. Are the laws in his state being followed. And is this being reported as income. And I feel this is everybodys businessNov 17, 2010 at 6:14 pm #1665463
@cbertLocale: N. California
I think the bottom line is that the quantities are sufficient to be in violation of the law. The behavior is resale, requiring a resale and business license as well as taxes to be paid. In addition to the questionable ethics already brought up, this is criminal behavior and piratism.
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