Energy for the Trail

[charles conger]

I have been using a new energy drink called Lift OFF from Herbalife. It is effervescent and just drops into my water bottle to make an 8 ounce whammy of vitamin c all the b complexes, guarana, ginko, and panax. No sugar, no calories. Has 74 mg of caffeine ( about like a cup of coffee ) You can buy from me at reduced price on shipping. 10 to a box – contact me at [email protected] if you want to try. Imagine a natural energy drink on the trail. Works for me…

[John Garberson]

Is Lift OFF marketed as an ‘energy’ drink? My understanding is that, by definition, zero calories equals zero energy.

On the other hand, if vitiamins and caffeine are considered energy sources than Lift OFF would be an energy drink.

I have wished for the return of effervescent tablets with no results that I know of. Fizzies came back for a very short time but they couldn’t make a go at it in the market.

[Summit CO]

Split, Kook!

Sounds like ZipFizz.

[charles conger]

B vitamins are all about our food being metabolized more efficientely. Better metabolics = higher absorption of nutrients in the food we eat on the trail. Lift Off doesn’t provide calories. However, it provides the very thing our calories need to be absorbed and transferred into energy – B complex. Ginko helps with my focus after a long day in the Smokies and lower Appalachians.

[charles conger]

wow summit, pretty nasty post.you must have all the answers for all of us kooks??? we will pray to you old wise one.

[Summit CO]

Caffiene has been shown to be unhealthy if taken before/during exercise. Cardiac and pulmonary vasoconstriction are not the best thing to have going on when you are physically exerting yourself. Guarana is biochemically identical to caffiene (CNS stim, diuretic properties, vasoconstrictor, elevates HR), chemically identical as well!

As John stated, your “energy” drink does not appear to contain any actual energy.

“Split, kook” = joke from another forum (TGR) for when someone comes on with shameless self promotion. Your post is obviously just an advertisement for a product your are repping/distroing.

[charles conger]

is that the reason for all of the chocolate on the trail? all of the chocolate in enrgy bars? talk about caffiene. UCLA School of human nutrition would disagree with your sources

[Summit CO]

Sure… chocolate is in energy bars because of the minute amounts of caffiene… it has nothing to do with taste, other chemicals, and the high calorie/weight properties of chocolate… sugars and fats… that’s just a bunch of hooey… take your No-Doze pills and hike forever ;-)

[Summit CO]

Study details can be found here:
http://www.forschungsportal.ch/unizh/p2985.htm

Abstracts, sumamry, discussion of caffiene/exercise study:
Caffeine Blunts Bloodflow to Heart During Exercise
http://www.nutraingredients.com/news/ng.asp?n=65279-caffeine-exercise-heart
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2006-01/acoc-clb011306.php
http://health.dailynewscentral.com/content/view/0002055/63/

‘Researcher Dr Philipp Kaufmann, of the University Hospital, Zurich, Switzerland, said: “I now would not recommend that any athlete drink caffeine before sports. It may not be a physical stimulant, and may even adversely affect physical performance. It may not be as harmless as we thought before, particularly if you suffer from coronary artery disease or if you are in the mountains.’ From the Staffnurse.com article on the study.

Guarana=Caffeine (just another name):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guarana

[charles conger]

Sugar and calories? At last glance, sugar was an empty, non nutritional, bleached with arsenic product. Wow, good suggestion. Get up on the sugar, bonk, need more sugar. bonk and on and on and on.

Believe me, my post was about a real product, with real nutritional value and I certainly don’t need to sell it on this forum. It can be found all over the web. It is also the ENERGY drink of choice on the AVP Volleyball tour. What is your concern with this product? Are you the resident forum medical expert? You seemed to jump on this on e pretty fast. Any baggage here?

[charles conger]

By the way Summit…I haven’t seen you take Ryan to task for selling the individual packets of coffee for the trail. Hmmmm…

[Summit CO]

“Sugar and calories? At last glance, sugar was an empty, non nutritional, bleached with arsenic product. Wow, good suggestion. Get up on the sugar, bonk, need more sugar. bonk and on and on and on.”

Wait… so you are sayin Chocolate is bad or good? I am confused… make up your mind!

Chocolate has sugars and fat. That is why it is a high calorie food. You say sugars are bad for me? I’ll try to remind my cells of that fact as they break down polysacharides and disacharides and convert to make glucose (which they break down into pyruvic acid etc etc etc) to make ATP so my body can SURVIVE.

I drink coffee and tea when I am backpacking. I try to do it when there will be at least a few hours before I’m pumping my heart hard. Nobody is selling coffee as a zero calorie energy drink. Even diet Red Bull has calories ;-) Calories represent energy.

But, I’ll try to remember your product the next time I’m in a volleyball tourney ;-)

Now if you find fault with Dr. Kauffman’s peer reviewed study, please, let’s hear it!

[Summit CO]

Here is more info:

http://www.herbalife.com/hl/templates/templatepreportal/herbalife/products/display.do?itemId=c_type_lift_off

“Herbalife produces weight-loss, weight-management, nutritional products”

“Lift OFF Key Benefits”
“* Helps you stay focused for improved concentration.*”
“Liftoff™ fights fatigue and improves mental performance.*”

“*=These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration.”

He says he is offering a discount. Most places offer this herbal supplement at $15.95 although ebay has it at <$9. What is your price?

[John S.]

nm

[charles conger]

Wow! What a spin. Trying to convince us that refined sugars that are put in our foods along with trans fats to make them solid are of nutritional benefit.

Not to mention the sodium. You would be better served to post somewhere rather than this forum. I thought this forum was about real nutrition and hydration. Not nuts, candies and coffee…

Lat post..someone needs to delete to the whole forum. What a joke.

[Summit CO]

“Wow! What a spin. Trying to convince us that refined sugars that are put in our foods along with trans fats to make them solid are of nutritional benefit.”

Yet again, you speak without knowledge. Even a lowly Hershey bar has ZERO transfats. I still cannot figure out whether you like or dislike chocolate… you keep changing pace…

Nobody is saying we should stock up on Oreos for trail food.

So what sugar do you hate? What is a “processed” sugar? Why are they “bad”? Are you hating on all sucrose? Do you hate all corn derived fructose? Do you understand how these are utilized in a cell and turned into energy?

Or are you another “prophet of health” just regurgitating health “facts” you were fed by Herbalife/other without questioning it or taking time to understand the subject of nutrition? Honest question…

“I thought this forum was about real nutrition and hydration.”

Me too! I thought the forum was about trail food and recipies, not health fad concentration supplements from a herbal weightloss company, “zero calorie energy,” and shameless self promotion of the same.

“Not nuts, candies and coffee…”

Nuts are bad? They aren’t real nutrition? Really? Uhoh… ;-) I’d better stick to zero calorie caffiene/vitamin supplement powder to be safe…

Coffee is bad but your caffiene/guarana packed herbal powder is good?

“Lat post..someone needs to delete to the whole forum. What a joke.”

I think you just have a problem with someone daring to question your holy cow of an herbal supplement (which you are trying to sell) while you seem unable mount any real logical or scientific counterpoint to the questions raised.

As much fun as you are providing, I’d be happy to engage you in a real debate as well…

[Summit CO]

As long as you are attacking “processed” sugars you might look at your own ingredient list for LiftOFF: CONTAINS SUCRALOSE.

What is sucralose? Why reprocessed “processed” sugar! It is an chlorinated artificial sweetener DERIVED FROM SUCROSE. It makes your powder sweet. Sucralose is better known under its brand name Splenda. I like Splenda, but you’ve been hoist on your own petard.

OTHER INGREDIENTS OF NOTE IN LIFTOFF:

Sodium Benzoate: Oh that “evil” sodium you were speaking of… this sodium salt is a preservative.

Corn Syrup Solids: Uhoh… processed corn products… ALARM! ;-)

Sodium Bicarbonate (the #2 ingredient in this powder): more “evil sodium” (this is used as a pH buffer in your blood and is a vital elocrolyte in proper quantities… see sodium isn’t necessarily bad!)

“Use this forum to discuss the acquisition, packaging, and preparation of backcountry ingestibles. Post your favorite trail recipes too.”

Is the stated purpose of the forum…
Perhaps you should try gear swap next time? I promise I won’t question it there!

[William Wright]

I was persuaded to take gingko supplements briefly in the hope of improving concentration and mental performance, but then I read that the dose needed to bring such effects about was more than enough to cause rectal bleeding.

[Anonymous]

This thread seems to have triggered an epidemic of “rectal bleeding”. Is it the Herbal Life elixir or an allergic reaction to the mere mention of it, albeit in a mildly commercial vein? C’mon, guys, lighten up a bit. You’re disrupting the community “wa”.

[Sarah Kirkconnell]

I’d rather eat real food than some “elixer” made in a lab. Anything with caffiene or genticially similar is not a good idea when doing strenous activities. A cup of joe or a chocolate bar isn’t a bad chocie, but chugging pills and drinks that are “energy” items is never a good idea. It can really mess with your body. I know I cannot take anything like that! Lord, what it does to my blood pressure is bad. In fact, if you even have a hint of high blood pressure or even starter hypertension, you NEED to avoid stuff like this. It is VERY bad for you!!

Anyhoo, not sure why the OP thinks nuts are not real food. Nuts are a natural powerhouse of vitamins, fat and energy. But then again, they won’t make one a ton of money ;-) My Dr recomended that I consume 1/4 cup of unsalted nuts daily to help my circulation..and bingo, my varicose veins don’t hurt anymore. I eat nuts on every trip I go on. Buy them at Trader Joe’s on the cheap.

[charles conger]

My experience with Lift Off has been very positive. I use the product with about two hours left in my day on the trail. My reasoning for this is the increased absorption value that I will get from the vitamin load (100% of C, 200% Thiamin, 100% Riboflavin, 100% Niacin, 300% Vitamin B 6, 200% Vitamin B 12, 100% Biotin, 200% Pantothenic Acid,
215 mg Sodium (205 mg from Sodium Bicarbonate) as my body is stressed from the high mileage and sometimes over 1000 ft a mile of elevation gain I experience here in the Appalachians. It is not that I think I need more vitamins, but the fact that the stress from the haul always leaves me more susceptible to the effects of fatigue. In my opinion, this is the reason most injuries happen later in the hike with many being directly attributed to fatigue. So I want to raise my chances of absorption of the nutrients I will desperately need at this time during my hike. The term for this kind of nutrition is micro nutrition and needs much more study, but B complex vitamins are B complex vitamins. Plus, all of these are water soluble, so there is no chance of toxic buildup The caffeine does give me a mental boost and a burst of energy to lessen the chances, at least in my opinion, of having a mentally and physically fatigued mishap. In researching the cardiovascular effects of caffeine on athletes, either professional or recreational, I find opinions, very credible sources, on both sides of the spectrum. It is well known that caffeine does affect the circulatory system as well as the central nervous system, but I can find no conclusive, universally accepted opinions that caffeine has any detrimental effects on Endurance Athletes. There are even some opinions that caffeine, in the doses that Lift-Off or a cup of coffee provide may be beneficial to people who have already developed caffeine tolerance.
If it was universally accepted that caffeine was a danger during physical exertion, I believe that all substances that contain caffeine would be labeled as such. I would also think that anyone who had developed the opinion from whatever sources they use that caffeine was a threat would be in the coffee threads of this forum warning the morning coffee drinkers of the peril their morning cup of joe was putting them in.

As far as chocolates for energy I will only eat dark chocolate broken into small bites mixed with unsalted almonds and lightly salted peanuts. I would think that all who are serious hikers know the benefits of GORP. However, the Hershey Bar that is Milk Chocolate has no place in my Trail Mix. I know what contains trans fats (most energy bars) and what contains saturated fats (5 grams in the Hershey) along with what refined, processed, bleached sugar is (22 – 1 gram packets in a Hershey) as opposed to pure cane sugar or honey. I also like to make a cookie called birdseed that contains oatmeal, honey and dark chocolate. Just melt the chocolate and mix in the oats and honey. Place on wax paper and let stand at room temperature until the chocolate re-hardens. MMM-MMM.
I also love Almond butter and sweet potato butter on 7-grain bread. I cut the sandwich into 1 inch squares, wrap in individual foil packets for day hikes.

It may have been in poor taste for me to post the Lift Off for sale in this forum. But it was not to “shamelessly self promote” as has been so often noted in this thread. My intent was to give free shipping to anyone who wanted to sample the product. That is all.
I am deeply interested in real nutrition on the trail. As I said before, if ifs and buts were candy and nuts we would all be happy…

[charles conger]

Sarah,
Would you please show me where I said nuts were not healthy. I never said that Lift Off should be taken as a substitute for food. That would be foolish. If you look at my second reply, the vitamins, of which there are many,in Lift Off increases the absorption of the good stuff found in those unsalted nuts that you so wisely eat.That is how the drink is considered to give you sustained power, by nourishing your cells with vitamins c and all of the b complexes. If you are sensitive to caffeine please do not take anything with caffeine. But Lift Off contains less caffeine than most one cup coffees. Please don’t let what Summit spins because of his resentment toward Herbalife. I am not trying to make a ton of money off of this product. I just shared what I thought was sound science coming from the UCLA School of Human Nutrition. Forgive??

[Sarah Kirkconnell]

It was more directed at the comment that nuts were not good food…I do understand your point though in that a lot of ultralighters rely on nuts for food on long hikes-but they are a good source of, nearly a perfect food.
As for me…well, I don’t drink caffiene for the most part anymore. And for me, 215 mg of sodium is quite a bit ;-) That and hearing my heart jackhammer is not fun. Heck, I cannot even take cold medicine, as it does the same thing as ANY stimulant-which is what the Herbalife is.
Nothing against you, just pointing out out the dangers, that is all. A normal healthy person usually isn’t bothered by stimulants, but add in dehydration and over exertion and you can have a bad mix :-(

[charles conger]

I rely heavily on nuts on the trail. You are correct. They are a near perfect food, especially unsalted. I have concerns with the sodium in salted, but after a day here in the south on the trail, I can sweat most of the sodium I need out. So sodium is not necessarily a bad thing in some cases.Lightly salted nuts are a good thing in our summer heat and humidity.
I have read some of your posts in other threads. Very informed. Thanks for the reply. As Roy would say, Happy Trails to you…

[Peter Wise]

Sarah, I’m also nuts about nuts. I’m not vegen or raw, but when exercising, I stay away from caffiene and sugar and go for a good mix of protien and carbs like a small handfull of almonds and an apple about a half hour prior to exertion.

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