New shelter

[Sam Farrington]

Adam,
> "What does everyone think of the Hubba …?"

Have some vicarious experience with the Hubba. When they first came out several years ago, bought one for a friend who needed something more reliable for heavy thunderstorms in New England. (We got wiped out on a high, exposed place called "Bulldozer Flats" on the Cohos Trail in NH, and had to waste an extra day just drying out). Have since made her a set a carbon poles that took off about 6 oz., and am working on a silnylon fly that will take off at least another 6 oz. Also, may make a pole set of Easton .344" O.D. poles that will still be several ounces lighter than the DAC featherweights that come with the tent, but stronger than the carbon. She has been very satisfied with the tent, and advises that it has been the one tent to keep her dry in storms, while providing good headroom. The biggest drawback is the floor width, 26", which would be too confining for me, especially with my 2 shelties, who are small, but do take up space. The length is not much over seven feet either, which can be confining for a six+ footer. With the modifications, the tent will be no heavier than the Fly Creek, and provide much more headroom. Unfortunately, the other Hubba, the HP is not much of an improvement in weight, with the window, and the addition of a partly DWR treated fabric interior to make it more weatherproof (The Hubba has an all netting inner). Note that in a gale, the Hubbas need secure side guys, as while freestanding, their design does not have a lot of lateral (side-to-side) stability. There are guy loops for this on the Hubba fly.
The Hubba is a great design, but it begs for a crossing front-to-back pole like the Akto or the new Tarptents, which would make it truly awesome. Only around seven additional feet of pole length would do it.
Hope this is helpful.
Sam

[Adam DuComb]

Guys thanks for all the input, I feel my search is much closer to an end now. Hell, I learned things about fabrics I had no idea where even issues. However I am still a bit confused and unsure about some tent fabrics. The Copper Spur and Fly Creek both use a 1200mm coated silnylon fly and floor. I've seen and read reviews raising their concerns for the weatherproofness of this fabric. Also I have seen these tens and have been able to see through the fabric. I am concerned with their ability to keep water out and resist abuse. So are their floors actually waterproof or just water resistant and how durable are they? I feel if I touched the fabric I could tear it. How does BA fabric compare to the 10000mm coated nylon floor of the Hubba? The Hubba has a way more zero's (a little more than 8 times as much coating!!!) how significant are these factors ( nylon vs silnylon, denier value, and pu coating) in determining waterproofness??

Right now I'm thinking heavilt about the Hubba (seems to be more storm worthy) and the Copper Spur (better living quaters). So anyone with experience with either, especially both, any input would be MUCH appreciated! But still the Scarp keeps coming back (love the lightweight but have the most concerns out of the bunch for fabric weatherproofness).

PLEASE! someone make a convincing argument for the best 3-season New England tent for me!

Thanks again
Adam

[John G]

In general: Silnylon is waterproof enough for rain, but not for keeping you dry while kneeling (or sometimes even sitting) on wet ground since the extra pressure forces the water through the fabric. Site selection, or groundcloth (a piece of 1-2mm thick plastic or polycro (window insulation film), or a sleeping bag cover (light bivy) with silnylon bottom will fix that).

Also, silnylon is suprising tear resistant, but not very abrasion resistant. Eurathane coated is waterproof enough to kneel on, and much more abrasion resistant, but twice as heavy. Sil works great for tarps & tent flys & OK for bottoms if you camp on pine needles or leaves.

Some people say big rain drops falling from great heights, or being driven by high winds can penetrate silnylon a little & cause a "mist" to come through. Most people think it's really condensation on the inside being shaken loose by the rain hitting the fabric though. Site selection helps with this too (under the canopy of big trees, next to a windbreak, etc). It won't be a problem if you use a double wall tent. If water shakes off the fly, it will roll down the outside of the mesh. Downside is 1.5-2 times more weight than a single wall tent…

ps: I like my Sierra Designs Lightning better than the MSR Hubba. Easier set-up, much wider, very stable in side winds, solid at the bottom (no wind-blown rain issues) – but it's slightly shorter (issues for 6ft+ folks), and the door on the fly of the Hubba is easier to get in/out though.

[Don Selesky]

"PLEASE! someone make a convincing argument for the best 3-season New England tent for me!"

I'd actually suggest a hammock. Given the plethora of rocks and roots in New England, a hammock is often the best way to get a decent night's sleep, because finding a spot of level ground is often a challenge.

My current favorite hammock is the Warbonnet Black Bird. Very well made, and unusually comfortable. Under a good tarp (like the MLD Hex Tarp), it's heaven.

[Adam DuComb]

Don, unfortunatley I'm a belly sleeper and thats really uncomfotable in a hammock. The girlfriend loves her hammock but I just cant do them.

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