Dec 10, 2008 at 2:08 pm #1232540
@hechoendetroitLocale: South Kak
"Can you imagine if it was Yellowstone Park and people were shooting up grizzlies? No one would ever get away with it. But this ocean, because it's out of sight, out of mind, [shark finning] carries on," said Knights.Dec 10, 2008 at 5:55 pm #1463564
(Would it would be any better if at least the whole shark was used?)
…but pretty much the same as every other species that humans are pushing to the brink due to commodification, consumption, habitat loss, or any other other reason we choose to destroy them.
Native salmon populations?
How big can we make this list if we try?
And as far as grizzlies, Californians have already done it; the last one here was killed about 80 years ago.Dec 11, 2008 at 6:47 am #1463638
If you are really interested in this issue, you should rent the documentary 'Sharkwater'. This is the exact issue it covers and it can be quite disturbing. I actually just watched Sharkwater about a week ago (I highly recommend it) and it really is unbelievable. The other issue that goes along with the shark finning is ways they do it…one is longlining. Basically setting out a huge fishing line that catches anything and everything that is around, but then only keep the sharks, and not even the whole thing. It is quite sad when they hoist a giant shark onto the boat, cut it's fins off while it flops about the boat and then toss it back in the ocean. It tries to swim but obviously can't and just floats the the bottom.
I do realize that it is a documentary trying to portray the people as evil (and make money doing it in the process), but it really had an impact on me. I don't recommend watching it over dinner.Dec 11, 2008 at 7:33 am #1463654
Thanks, never heard of the documentary.Dec 11, 2008 at 11:13 am #1463705
@blister-freeLocale: Puertecito ruins
>>Can you imagine if it was Yellowstone Park and people were shooting up grizzlies?
This sort of thing really only requires enough imagination to envision a future world even more divided along socio-economic lines than it is today. If grizzly bear liver, let's say, should ever become an exotic delicacy, coveted for its miraculous abilities to restore youthful vigor and potency, then the fate of the bear could well hinge on the covert motivations of the desperately unemployed in the rural American West. This sounds purely hypothetical, but it can happen here, as it has already in the front country with metals looting when copper was trading over $4 a share. The only saving graces seem to be hard times across the board, or greater economic equality and opportunity.Dec 11, 2008 at 11:39 am #1463708
Craig (or anyone esle),
Here's the link to the documentary.
I'm pretty sure it won a bunch of awards and whatnot. Take a look at the preview on the first page, in fact, everyone should who is interested in this. It gives you an idea of how finning goes on and what the documentary covers. Quite unbelievable that the documentary lead is so young. I would think he was 25 years of age at the most.
Enjoy.Dec 11, 2008 at 2:41 pm #1463746
I just watched the documentary. great stuff. inspiring and disturbing at the same time. well done. thanks for sharing.Dec 12, 2008 at 9:39 pm #1464026
Love it! I have no problems eating animals — as long as they are not endangered. I prefer humane raising/hunting/fishing/killing — but we are a very long way from that. Cattle and chicken slaughtering's here in the US aren't pretty either.Dec 12, 2008 at 10:04 pm #1464028
I wouldn't compare shark-finning with cattle slaughter. Cattle are first knocked unconscious by a stun-gun and most do not suffer any pain when they are killed. There are some problems with this process (not 100% effective) but it is a far-cry from cutting off fins and tossing the live animal back into the ocean. It also appears extremely wasteful… because the fins are much more valuable than the meat, the whole rest of the animal is simply dumped. Not cool.
I wouldn't have a problem with it though if (a) the sharks were actually killed on the spot (b) they are not endangered or removing them did not significantly impact on the ecosystem (c) the rest of the shark meat was used.Dec 12, 2008 at 10:08 pm #1464030
Yes, they should kill the animal — and use it. I am actually quite surprised that only the fins are taken. After all, we Chinese are famously known for eating everything! :)
Ashley — A few months ago, volunteers from The Humane Society secretly filmed some going on's in a cattle slaughterhouse — and its release to the news media prompted a national outcry! I am pretty skeptical about the humaneness of it all.
As for chickens, here in the US (and likely elsewhere as well) — chickens are cooped up so tightly that they can hardly move — pretty much from hatching to dying. The sharks have freedom of movement — and suffered "only" at the end. Not to excuse shark abuse, but we have much bigger problems with our large-scale agri-businesses.Dec 12, 2008 at 10:18 pm #1464032
Yes, chicken conditions are disgusting. I will only buy free-range and organic chicken and eggs. There have even been some question-marks over free-range recently (in Aus)… apparently some "accredited" farms still have too many chickens in the barns so that they can't find their way to the outside (even though they are "free" to go outside!). Organic is best!
I'm sure there are some dodgey slaughterhouses, but I think cattle generally get a better deal than chickens. Normal chicken farms are revolting… watch Jamie Oliver's "chicken dinners" special to get an idea!Dec 12, 2008 at 10:36 pm #1464038
Click HERE for an excerpt of the cow abuse video shown on national TV a few months ago. 'Downer' (sick) cows were prodded for slaughter — in violation of state laws — at a plant that supplied beef to California schools.Dec 15, 2008 at 5:51 pm #1464590
Bottom line: life lives on life.
Civilized food processes are not nice.
However, neither are wild animals.
We enjoy watching videos of grizzlies ripping up salmon, but we dislike a cow getting fork-lifted.
And for veggies, the only difference is they can't try to run away. Look what we do to wheat, potatoes, rice, etc.Dec 15, 2008 at 7:34 pm #1464607
First off, if you don't care, then I won't convince you. If you don't think you should care, stop reading and carry on. I'm not trying to preach or convert anyone.
Just posing some questions.
For those that are disgusted or bothered with the slaughter and use of animals for food, why not do something about it? Watching videos is great, but will it change anything?
Nobody in an industrialized, wealthy country has to participate in this. Choices abound.
As for adopting an animal-free diet, why not try it? What could it hurt?
For those that say you "never could", you can still do the best you can, no? Why not? If this is something you care about, it's better than nothing. Under these circumstances, is it a matter of can't or a matter of won't? There's a big difference.
As for the idea of "life living on life", great! Animal Planet! Survival of the Fittest! Hurray for the wild kingdom!
Grizzlies eat salmon because it's WHAT THEY DO. Spiders eat flies because of they didn't, they'd starve. It's WHAT THEY DO. If eating meat/animal products is WHAT HUMANS DO, I should be dead right now.
As a human, I have a CHOICE as to whether I want to participate in the meat production systems humans have created.
Think about it.
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